Which of these mics should I use to record grand piano?

[deadeno]

Hello All.

I've been asked by a friend to record his daughter playing grand piano at their home.

I've never recorded grand piano before, but I have some decent mics so I'm wondering which to bring.

Here's what I have:

Rode NTK
Beyerdynamic M160
Sennheiser e901 (boundary)
Shure 57

I know that stereo pairs are recommended for acoustic piano, so I'm also considering investing in a pair of Karma K-10s or something comparable.

Any advice on mics, mic combinations, or placement would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[-3db]

If that's what you have use the Beyerdynamic M 160 positioned over middle c behind the hammers. Use a mic pre that can boost that ribbon enough for a good signal.

You could probably borrow or rent Matched pair sdc and put them over that same spotting angled to low and high. Then go into a low noise mic pre.

[A.David.MacKinnon]

If the piano sounds good in the room you can often get really nice results putting a mic a few feet back from the side (with the lid open). I'd start with your Rode in that position. you can move forward or back to adjust the amount of room in the sound.
You can also get some really nice sounds with a boundry mic attached to the lid or on the floor under the piano.
I'd also try the Beyer inside the piano pointed into one of the holes in the harp.

Other than that just try moving the mics around till you get a result you like.

[A.David.MacKinnon]

Here's a good primer on piano recording -
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan08/a ... g_0108.htm

[Scodiddly]

I wouldn't try to be that far inside the piano unless there was a lot of ambient noise or bad acoustics. Either the NTK or the Beyer on a stand peering into the piano from the side.

[deadeno]

Thanks everyone for the responses, very helpful.
Dave, thanks for posting that primer. Looking forward to
reading it.

[ott0bot]

On a grand the micing choices for me have always been decided by a few questions. Mainly....

Do you want to have a true stereo image?
If so then having a stereo pair is fairly important. you can double a mono track then do a bunch of eq work....but that usually sounds like crud buckets. So if you want a accurate stereo image, then I'd see if you can borrow a pair. You can definately get a good piano sound without a pair, but to get an accurate picture of the piano, with more balanced highs and lows you'll need some distance. which leads too...

how much room sound you want?
This usually revolves around how good the room sounds. The farther away the more room you'll hear, so I finding the right position is really important. Put on some headphones and move the mic around to when you have a nice blend and you're getting a good mix of the highs and lows.

Good advice so far. If the room sounds good, I'd set it up like Scodiddly said. The ntk is good if she is playing softly since it's more sensetive and it's got a really low noise floor, otherwise the m160 will sound really nice if your preamp has enough gain. You could also might try the e901 taped to the lid if you want more attack and then you can blend the two tracks to taste. If the room sounds like crap get in there like -3db suggested, but I'd also set up a room mic just for a little ambiance. Bring some blankets and extra mic stands, then cover up reflective surfaces and it'll do a lot of good and helping the room mic have less relected sound. If it still don't sound decent, at least you tried.

[Scodiddly]

And set up as many mics as you can record at once. If you can record stereo, just do stereo. Maybe you'll end up with only one usable track... but it'll still be usable. Or maybe you can EQ the two dissimilar mics to work better as a stereo pair.

[NewAndImprov]

The M160 is figure 8, right? In that case, why not try doing a mid-side setup with the NTK as the mid mic and the 160 as the side. Find a spot that sounds good, put the pair there, with the NTK facing the piano, and the 160 at 90 degrees to the NTK. I recorded some solo piano, in a nice sounding room, with a Royer-mod MXL as the mid mic, and a Shinybox ribbon as the side, and was very pleased with the results.

[{}]

The m160 is hypercardioid...

[NewAndImprov]

The m160 is hypercardioid...

Ooops. never mind.

[IanWalker]

Stereo pair (ORTF, XY, MS, whatever), and play with the position until it sounds good. Hopefully they have a decent-sounding room.

Just whatever you do, don't mic under the lid, near the hammers. It generally sounds like an electric piano if you do that. Actually, doing that (sometimes you have to if you're sharing your mics with the front of house guy) made me appreciate how good some of those electric and midi pianos get it. They're accurately reproducing a lame micing of a real piano.

Give it some air. Pick a pair that suit the situation (if its fairly bright, use a setup that's nice and warm, for example), and place them somewhere where your ears like how it sounds. Treat them like your head, and see how that sounds.

Maybe 3-5 feet out in front of the opening in the lid?

[Bill @ Irie Lab]

A boundary mic on resting on a mouse pad lying on the sounding board is a sound.

[nobody, really]

Might try placing a mic under the piano, pointing up, 'bout halfway between the (hopefully) wood floor and the soundboard. Done this with a pair of 421's a few times.