Mac Pro and Pro Tools/Logic

[TapeOpLarry]

Hey, I'm buying a new Mac Pro to run HD2 Accel card-based Pro Tools on and jumping up to PT9HD. Also installing Logic Pro for some clients. Anyone have recommendations for core amount and RAM size based on real world use? We're upgrading from a G5 from 5 years back, so this will be a treat, besides having to do the damn PCI card exchange!

[kittonian]

4GB of RAM will be fine for right now. PT9 still isn't 64-bit so it's not going to use anything above that anyway. We run a Mac-Pro 8-CORE with 4GB of RAM and an HD|3 Accel rig. Never even thought about the RAM.

[TapeOpLarry]

Thanks Joshua.

Anyone have experience with Logic Pro on Mac Pro and how much it taxes the machine?

[Anthony Caruso]

The Quads are also pretty smokin'.... a rig I work on a lot is a 2.66 GHz Quad, PTHD 2 (non Accel). I've tried to crash it, I can't. 128 tracks (with audio), RTAS plugins on every track, virtual instruments, 128 buffer size, the thing won't even hiccup. 16 GB RAM.

Kittonian, how many cores do you run PTHD with? Only asking because I had read about crashes trying to use cores above 4 or 6, do you run into problems there?

On Apple's site they now have refurbished 2.8GHz Quads, and it comes with a 1 year warranty, so you can save $400 on the machine and $250 on not getting Applecare. And they are 64-bit (as opposed to the 2.66 I use).

As far as RAM, yeah OSX only supports 4GB per application, but it's still good to have more, especially if you use Reason or other applications simultaneously, as going into virtual RAM scenarios can clog things up a bit.

And though I am just guessing on this part, with the native power I've seen in the quad I can't imagine Logic would be too much.

So I guess it comes down to your budget. 8 cores may be more future proof, but in real-life performance I can't kill this quad. A dfference of almost $1700 if you go with an Apple refurb.

Just my experience...

[TapeOpLarry]

Thanks Anthony. I think I'll be ordering one Monday....

[roscoenyc]

Warranty or not there's no way in the world I would get a Apple Refurb to be the center of my studio/business.

Friends don't let friends buy Apple Refurbs.





Apple customer (happy) since '91

[Anthony Caruso]

Warranty or not there's no way in the world I would get a Apple Refurb to be the center of my studio/business.

Friends don't let friends buy Apple Refurbs.

I (and I'm sure Larry or anyone else interested) would love to hear a specific horror story or 2...I'm not saying that facetiously, I'd really like to know if there's something consistently wrong with them. I researched a lot before purchasing the 2.66 I posted about and most people have nothing bad to say about it. And it worked perfectly out of the (not original) box and still does (knock on wood haha).

I get what you're saying, the word refurb does sound shady. If it weren't from Apple themselves and didn't come with a warranty (with the option of Applecare), I wouldn't consider it.

I have a refurb Viewsonic LCD monitor, had it for 6 years, no problem. Again, manufacturer refurb.

Personally, I'd trust a refurb over buying one used. Or maybe I'm missing something. Let me know...

[roscoenyc]

Off the record info from a couple different Apple sources (former Apple employees, Apple Store and 3rd party seller) all w the same basic story.

Apple rarely exchanges computers.
They usually try to fix the problem (new motherboard....etc) and send
back the computer. Sometimes they just can't fix the problem then
they give the customer a new rig.
These very troubled returned rigs are the ones that get reconditioned and sold as 'refurb'.

These computers may work for you, but they may not. Depends on if you have a spare rig or can afford possible downtime.

[Anthony Caruso]

Anytime a change to a vital part of a functioning system is made, it's a downtime risk. Larry's is like, a bunch of risks, changing a computer, exchanging the HD cards, using PT 9 which has only been used publicly for a few weeks now...

I worried more about my PT upgrade than the computer!

I feel like the computer's refurbished-ness, which may or may not be the result of a technical failure issue, but definitely has been through Apple QA twice in it's life, is just a piece of the puzzle here. How much is that puzzle piece worth?

$ vs. Risk. I guess that's up to each user. In my case, I can jump back to the G5 if the poop hits the fan, as this HD2 system is PCIx cards now housed in a PCIx -> PCIe chassis. With Larry's situation, exchanging the cards altogether, that's not an option.

Anyway, I'm not affiliated with Apple. It just worked for me. Regardless of how you go, Larry, you'll love the jump from G5 to quad/octo/whatever you get.

[kittonian]

Kittonian, how many cores do you run PTHD with? Only asking because I had read about crashes trying to use cores above 4 or 6, do you run into problems there?

I run it with 6. No problems here. I have heard of some people having issues when they are using some of the more esoteric VIs but I've never experienced any problems as long as I leave two procs free for the OS.

[TapeOpLarry]

Yeah, I'm half thinking of getting 2 Mac Pros so we have a redundant system. Would make the Avid cards the only non-redundant items. Really. These are the things I think about.

[E.Bennett]

I guess I've been lucky. I've always purchased apple refurbs. I've never had issues and I abuse my computers.

[calaverasgrandes]

at a recent job I had I gutted and rebuilt macs every day. They are solid well engineered machines. Most of the refurbs I know of were logic board failures, keyboard/trackpad failure or LCD screen. These are the kind of things that can be fixed somewhat easily if you have the spare part. Thanks to the very clean internals of the macbook pros and mac pros you can swap out many major components in minutes. The CPU is on a daughter card, along with the ram.
The HDD is in a nice sled and so on.
I have never known a Mac pro power supply failure.
I have never known anyone have any trouble with an APPLE refurb. But then their refurbs are rarely more than a 15% discount. For almost the same scratch you can often buy a new box from someone like B&H photo and get parallels or some other nice stuff thrown in.
Plus, do the refurbs come with the keyboard, mouse and system discs?
Mac keyboards are pricey!

[wszalva]

Hey, I'm buying a new Mac Pro to run HD2 Accel card-based Pro Tools on and jumping up to PT9HD. Also installing Logic Pro for some clients. Anyone have recommendations for core amount and RAM size based on real world use? We're upgrading from a G5 from 5 years back, so this will be a treat, besides having to do the damn PCI card exchange!

FWIW, Logic 9.x (running 'native') likes a lot of RAM, especially when you get into dense sessions. When I run Logic in 32 bit mode on my fairly well-endowed 8 core Mac Pro (12 GB RAM) I still sometimes get 'out of memory' messages (mostly when I have a good amount of EXS and Kontakt samplers loaded into the session).

Running Logic in 64 bit mode (which is mostly how I'm doing it these days) clears the field, in terms of memory issues and some other yummy stuff. Of course, since PT is a 32 bit app, running Logic in 64 bit mode through the PT hardware is impossible. Either way, I would load up with as much RAM as budget allows. xx oo

[wszalva]

Hey, I'm buying a new Mac Pro to run HD2 Accel card-based Pro Tools on and jumping up to PT9HD. Also installing Logic Pro for some clients. Anyone have recommendations for core amount and RAM size based on real world use? We're upgrading from a G5 from 5 years back, so this will be a treat, besides having to do the damn PCI card exchange!

FWIW, Logic 9.x (running 'native') likes a lot of RAM, especially when you get into dense sessions. When I run Logic in 32 bit mode on my fairly well-endowed 8 core Mac Pro (12 GB RAM) I still sometimes get 'out of memory' messages (mostly when I have a good amount of EXS and Kontakt samplers loaded into the session).

Running Logic in 64 bit mode (which is mostly how I'm doing it these days) clears the field, in terms of memory issues and some other yummy stuff. Of course, since PT is a 32 bit app, running Logic in 64 bit mode through the PT hardware is impossible. Either way, I would load up with as much RAM as budget allows. xx oo