Have some money to spend. Help me prioritize.

[total_hack]

I have an alt-country band, and we'd like to try recording in my basement with gear I've accumulated over the years.

I have:

• 1 Shure KSM 44
  1 Shure SM57
  1 Sennheiser 421
  1 CAD GXL3000
  An assortment of low-end dynamic mics (like the kind that have on-off switches)
  1 MOTU 896 HD
  1 FMR RNP
  A decent DAW and some Waves plugins.

The goal here is just to get some stuff to put on our website and to use on a booking demo. Down the road, maybe release our own CD. I'm wondering about getting some additional gear. Some questions:

• Would an SDC mic to use for miking acoustic guitar & banjo be an improvement over what I already have?
  Can I do a reasonable recorderman-style 3-4 drum-micing setup with what I have? If not, what should I get?
  Should I get additional preamps for the drums so I dont have to use the stock MOTU pres?

Anything else you can think of that I might want to think about would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

[Nick Sevilla]

Hi,

I'd use the CAD mic for your stringed instrument overdubs.

Don't forget to filter out some of the low end you won't need on certain instruments.

As far as deciding to do a demo VS. a CD... just do all your recording pretendign it is going to be listened to by someone you care about, maybe then you'll realize there are no demos.

Cheers

[jgimbel]

Nick's nailed it. You can definitely work with what you've got. The only thing that sticks out to me that you can't do but might want to (and might help you) is having two matching mics for stereo. You're asking about a Recorderman setup, and having two SDCs would work beautifully for that, not to mention have acoustic guitar and banjo covered as you mentioned. Personally I use two MXL 603s (one of MXL's only good mic designs in my opinion, after trying to support them for a long time). They're on to the 604s now, which is the same but has a bass rolloff (might be great for your acoustic recording) and a -10db pad (great for overheads). Having a stereo pair of mics might open up some other options. I record drums all the time for full albums (as opposed to booking demos) with two 603s as overheads (recorderman setup) with a 57 on snare, and I usually use an SM7 but now that I've got (and LOVE) a 421, I'd say that'd work beautifully on kick too (I love it there).

I'm not sure I'd say not using the MOTU pre's needs to be a priority, if you're on a budget. Great preamps will improve the sound, but in a "using what you've got" situation I think what you've got would work nicely. Compare the MOTU pre's to the RNP and see what you think sounds nicest on what source and go with that.

PS - Nick is right, you might realize quickly that your "demo" sounds better than you expected. No you're not using $3000 mics and preamps but you've definitely got some gear that will work for some more than decent recordings.

[Recycled_Brains]

I'd maybe think about the fact that you have no pairs of mics.

Given what you've already got, I'd consider a 2nd KSM44 and 421.

[jgimbel]

I'd maybe think about the fact that you have no pairs of mics.

Glad you agree!

[Producer/Engineer]

You already have some good equipment... careful mic placement and treating the room will capture the best audio.

[total_hack]

Thanks for the replies, everyone. I've already made my first purchase: a $120 massive carpet remnant from CarpetLand. We have a decent-sized space, but with concrete floors, cinderblock walls, and exposed plywood ceilings, things sound pretty chaotic at times. So I'll cover most of the floor, and use some of it on the walls & ceiling over by where we'll record the drums. Is there any advantage to that Auralex stuff they sell at GC? Regarding the comments about not having any pairs of mics, do I lose anything by using 2 different mics for drum overheads?

Thanks again.

[Nick Sevilla]

Thanks for the replies, everyone. I've already made my first purchase: a $120 massive carpet remnant from CarpetLand. We have a decent-sized space, but with concrete floors, cinderblock walls, and exposed plywood ceilings, things sound pretty chaotic at times. So I'll cover most of the floor, and use some of it on the walls & ceiling over by where we'll record the drums. Is there any advantage to that Auralex stuff they sell at GC? Regarding the comments about not having any pairs of mics, do I lose anything by using 2 different mics for drum overheads?

Thanks again.

Good job!

Auralex is good for when you have a commercial facility and need to look good as well as treat the room.
If I were you,I would wait on the mic pair purchase, until you have at least determined that you REALLY need it for your situation.
If you do, try to get a second CAD like the one you have. LDCs are great in stereo pairs, and are more easily manipulated with EQ for different tasks.

Cheers

[dirtyragamuffin]

Don't waste your money on Auralex, especially don't bother with LENRDs, they aren't bass traps regardless of the marketing. I think you will find the space difficult to record in, lots of cement. Carpets will tame some some flutters and other assorted high end uglies; Auralex will do the same; I'd want some bass trapping around corners and some midrange taming of reflections, if I was going to spend some bucks on your rig I'd say acoustic treatments; think DIY 703/705 panels if on a tight budget.

All that said, on your list I was missing a good kick/bass mic. Can't go wrong with an AKG D112. Of course you have your 421 also. I'm thinking about a 4-mic drum setup though, like a D112/etc in the kick, KSM44 overhead, 57 on rack tom, 421 on floor tom. Recent 3-mic drum setups I've done were a matched pair of overheads and a D112 in the kick in a good room and got good results; those songs had lots of tom/perc fills so I wanted the matched stereo pair overhead. Also did a 2-mic setup that was just a LDC overhead and D112 in the kick in a good room; got away with that due to very sparse and not-too-important tom fills and a simple drum arrangement...so that illustrates that Brains my have something there with the point about your not having any pairs, but it depends on the situation...but I still think your top priority should be getting the room sounding better.

An SDC seems less important in your situation; that KSM44 should do a fine job on acoustic and banjo. Don't know the CAD but I'm sure it could pull those duties too.

Good luck and have fun!

[inasilentway]

you already have a pretty good mic collection. you might greatly enjoy a ribbon mic for certain things to make your country more "alt-" and less "radio"; depending on how much money you have to throw around, a pair of Cascade Fatheads could really rock your world and leave you not needing to spend a dime for the next few years.

An assortment of low-end dynamic mics (like the kind that have on-off switches)

I'd be interested in hearing more about this. if they're stuff like old EVs or Turners, they could be secret weapons.

[joninc]

get an sm7 - great vocal mic - great on guitar amps, drums - even acoustic guitar and banjo.

[JohnSuitcase]

Any possibility of tracking upstairs? Basements and untreated garages are tough spots to record. Not impossible, but for drums in particular, you'll do much better if you can temporarily set up in the living room, especially if it has higher ceilings.

Acoustic instruments are going to benefit from a bigger room, too.

If it were me, I'd commit to doing all the tracking one weekend, and setup upstairs. Get the drums and acoustic instruments down, then you can do overdubs downstairs if absolutely necessary.

There's nothing wrong with setting up a 'jam tape' rig in the rehearsal space, to capture new songs, etc. But I think you'll get far superior results in a bigger room.

Just clap your hands. If it sounds good, you can probably record something decent. If it sounds bad, go somewhere else and try again.

Good luck!

[Ryan Silva]

For close micing Banjo, and Acoustic in a very 'Untreated' area, I would look into getting a ribbon or two. They have tight patterns to minimize your reflections, and your banjo wont sound like a metal snare drum full of nickels...unless of course it IS a metal snare drum full of nickels.....wait...I just had an idea...

[Ryan Silva]

get an sm7 - great vocal mic - great on guitar amps, drums - even acoustic guitar and banjo.

Oh ya, and an sm7 while your at it.

[lionaudio]

I would look into getting a ribbon or two. They have tight patterns to minimize your reflections, and your banjo wont sound like a metal snare drum full of nickels...unless of course it IS a metal snare drum full of nickels.....wait...I just had an idea...

I may be wrong, but I would assume that because ribbons are figure-8 that wouldn't minimize reflection as compared to say, a hypercardoid. Picking up sound from both sides of the mic would mean that you are getting the instrument and whatever is bouncing around in the room on the other side of the mic