Transfer From Tape BACKWARDS For Bigger Punch!

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mechanicalmastering
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Transfer From Tape BACKWARDS For Bigger Punch!

Post by mechanicalmastering » Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:52 pm

I just heard about this old trick that engineers used to do when doing tape xfers, (2-track to 2-track, multitrack to digital, 2-track to digital, etc.),,, try transfering in reverse! The attack of all elements will be significantly increased and pronounced because the source you're xfering to will process an initial decay that builds towards the aftermentioned attack, verses having to scramble to process the complexity of an immediate attack with a decay afterwards. Cool trick, huh?

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Brett Siler
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Post by Brett Siler » Sun Nov 20, 2011 4:51 pm

In the book Mixing With Your Mind the author talks about mixing songs with the tape backwards. He said since you are hearing the attack of the instruments totally different your mix result could surprise you, in a good way. I have yet to try this yet though, I should give it a shot on a rainy day.

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Post by kslight » Sun Nov 20, 2011 5:43 pm

Try also --- transferring at half speed! Works especially well with "found" tapes of church Christmas recitals...not that I would know!

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mechanicalmastering
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Post by mechanicalmastering » Sun Nov 20, 2011 8:15 pm

Try also --- transferring at half speed! Works especially well with "found" tapes of church Christmas recitals...not that I would know!
I've always wanted to experiment with that. I feel strongly that, if one would lock the sync/clock/whatever in just right, you could get some seriously Hifi stuff going on. Hmmm.

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Post by accordion squeezist » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:47 pm

funny, I was just remembering about this procedure, and that it was a widespread practice. My machine doesn't go in rev but I could reverse the digital audio first, tape that, then reverse it again back in the DAW, and see if it's the same thing.

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Post by Dakota » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:55 pm

mechanicalmastering wrote:
Try also --- transferring at half speed! Works especially well with "found" tapes of church Christmas recitals...not that I would know!
I've always wanted to experiment with that. I feel strongly that, if one would lock the sync/clock/whatever in just right, you could get some seriously Hifi stuff going on. Hmmm.
Trade-offs. Tape and heads being band limited in any case, half-speed transfer can get more detail resolution in the mids and highs... but a likelihood of losing approximately the lowest octave in the low end. Depends on what's important in the program material.

That's why some people prefer lower tape speeds for low-intensive rock music. This being distinct from transfer tricks and considerations above, but food for thought: when I'm passing digital tracks out to tape and back to round and saturate them a bit, generally lower tape speeds are cooler for bass and kick and toms and snare, higher tape speeds for overheads and keys and strings and jangle guitars...

This thread definitely gets me thinking about transferring stuff to tape and back, backwards and forwards both, lining those up and seeing what the differential is. Particularly in the transients.

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Post by Electro-Voice 664 » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:19 pm

Here's a tune I mixed in reverse
http://stuporhero.com/track/wicked
There weren't any tape machines involved though
"Play ethnicky jazz to parade your snazz. On your five grand stereo."

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Post by drumsound » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:12 pm

Electro-Voice 664 wrote:Here's a tune I mixed in reverse
http://stuporhero.com/track/wicked
There weren't any tape machines involved though
Bizarre.

Isn't the point above to mix backward, and then flip the thing back forward?

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Post by Electro-Voice 664 » Mon Nov 21, 2011 11:59 pm

drumsound wrote:Isn't the point above to mix backward, and then flip the thing back forward?
Yes it is. However, like as mentioned in "Mixing With Your Mind" I had a mix for the song while playing forward, and ended up mixing it quite differently when we decided to throw it into reverse.... just didn't flip it again
"Play ethnicky jazz to parade your snazz. On your five grand stereo."

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Post by Tim A » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:06 am

mmm this might be the one of the better ideas to come from that book.

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Post by Tim A » Tue Nov 22, 2011 1:06 am

mmm this might be the one of the better ideas to come from that book.

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Post by Dominick Costanzo » Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:27 am

Puh-leeze!
Dominick Costanzo

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Post by Dominick Costanzo » Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:29 am

Total BS.
If that's happening, there's something wrong with your gear or with the way you are using it
Dominick Costanzo

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Post by Neal » Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:12 am

would you set compressor attack and release times playing it forward then eq and level in reverse or what? The thought of mixing in reverse gives me a head ache. But so does mixing normally sometimes. I enjoy tracking way more, but anyway, ya.... mixing in reverse: how would delay or reverb or gates or compressors or anything that depends on time work with everything swelling in constantly? Doesn't seem practical. Transferring might be a different story I suppose.

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Post by Matt C. » Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:25 pm

it seems like this would only make a difference if you're running the whole thing through a compressor. but if you're just doing a straight transfer, I don't think the new medium is "scrambling" to process the attack

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