cable routing with preamp

[ethansnew]

yo

so I bought my first preamp today, cause i am going on vacation and i needed something with phantom power so i could use a nice mic on a 4 track.

the dude at the store explained to me that i should go Mic --> preamp with an XLR cable, and then go from the preamp ----> 4 track with an XLR -> 1/4" cable . I said that my 4 track has an XLR in, wouldn't I just want to use another XLR to XLR cable to go from the preamp to the 4 track? He said the XLR --> 1/4" would be better because you dont want to use 2 XLR cables on either side of a preamp for some reason.

Could someone explain this to me, and do i need to get a special kind of XLR --> 1/4" cable to keep max fidelity goin' on?

thanks yall

[Gregg Juke]

It's not XLR to XLR that would be the problem, it would be that there are mike pres in the four-track already, so since you're using a decent external preamp, you want to bypass the four-track pres...

GJ

[ethansnew]

if i go into the 4 track with a quarter inch instead of an xlr it bypasses the pres completely or just to a greater degree?

are the pres on the 4 track controlled on the trim control, but not the volume fader?

[jgimbel]

if i go into the 4 track with a quarter inch instead of an xlr it bypasses the pres completely or just to a greater degree?

are the pres on the 4 track controlled on the trim control, but not the volume fader?

Just being a 1/4" input doesn't mean it bypasses the preamps on the 4 track. It's that you'd want to go to the 4 track's line inputs, if it has them, which are often 1/4", which is most likely what he was referring to (though are sometimes XLR, in which case yes, you'd just go from the preamp to that with an XLR). If your 4 track doesn't have line inputs, then you could go from the preamp to the 4 track with XLR or an XLR > 1/4" like he mentioned, wouldn't matter, and you'd generally want the trim all the way down on the 4 track, and use the preamp's output as your trim. That would minimize how much the preamp of your 4 track is affecting the signal, though it will still be more than using a line in which would be bypassing it.

If you've got the preamps in the 4 track and are happy with the sound, I'd just use a separate phantom power supply if all you're needing is phantom power, rather than getting a preamp specifically for it. If it's for sound reasons, then okay, but if all you need is to be able to use phantom power with your 4 track, just get a separate phantom power supply.

[Andy Peters]

if i go into the 4 track with a quarter inch instead of an xlr it bypasses the pres completely or just to a greater degree?

On pretty much all devices that have an XLR jack and a 1/4" jack feeding the same channel, then the 1/4" jack feeds the preamp, just like the XLR, except that the 1/4" input will never see phantom power, the 1/4" input is attenuated enough so that you don't overload with line-level input signals, and the 1/4" input will present a higher load impedance to the driving circuit.

In other words -- the preamp is always in the circuit.

But, really, get over that, because if you're using it as a line input, you're not applying a whole lot of gain, and besides, the preamp is generally the best part of any design. (So a sucky preamp means a sucky rest-of-circuit.)

As long as you're not clipping, you're fine.

-a

[brew]

if i go into the 4 track with a quarter inch instead of an xlr it bypasses the pres completely or just to a greater degree?

It depends, but there's no such thing as a greater/lesser degree of bypass. You'd have to download the manual and look at the block diagram to know if the 1/4 goes through the mic pre or not. For example if you look at the 424 mkIII page 47, you can see the 1/4 goes through the mic pre, but it is unbalanced. You'd theoretically have a cleaner line level signal plugged into the stereo input--but who knows if that circuit is any better, or if everything is balanced, use the XLR but with the trim turned down.

are the pres on the 4 track controlled on the trim control, but not the volume fader?

Faders do not control input trim levels.

The simple thing to remember is don't preamp a mic twice. Many budget mixers that send both jacks through the pre have a unity marking on the the trim for where it should be when using a line level signal (Mackie).

[Snarl 12/8]

I wish I knew a surefire way of finding unity on a trim pot. Or any pot for that matter.

[vvv]

Well, they say bongs are better'n ...

Never mind.