Soundcraft 200B master section mod

supafuzz · Post by **supafuzz** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:24 am

Nick Sevilla wrote:
supafuzz wrote:$22,500 for the ROOTS
Worth it.

worth it to you perhaps...but I couldnt justify $22,500 or $46,000 for 16 channels.

If go whole hog with 16 custom built discrete channels I'll end up spending under $5000 +/- but not $10K or $20k

Hey there's a ton of gear I can't afford out there but I have to run my business based on smart decisions and what will start paying for itself right away.

Jim Williams · Post by **Jim Williams** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:30 am

Sorry folks, you're not going to turn an old 200B into an API or Neve.

You could turn it into a money pit though.

Like the Gambler says:

"You got to know when to hold 'um, know when to fold 'um."

supafuzz · Post by **supafuzz** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:45 am

Jim Williams wrote:Sorry folks, you're not going to turn an old 200B into an API or Neve.

You could turn it into a money pit though.

Like the Gambler says:

"You got to know when to hold 'um, know when to fold 'um."

Folks meaning me>>>I reckon...yeah I'll probably do a couple of upgrades and enjoy it for what it is...Got a couple of high end Acopian power supplies and we will do the master section and amybe acouple of cap upgrades on the channels..
It does have the dual sweep mids>>this high and low end could use a little work it seems...but I'm liking the stock sound better than ITB already..

Dumping a ton of cash into this would be like having Volkswagon with a fiberglass Rolls Royce grill..ha ha....yeah going to take it slow...already foresee an additional patchbay in my immediate future.

supafuzz · Post by **supafuzz** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:20 am

Ok got it up and running and it sounds pretty damn good so far..big improvement from ITB even with all the outboard I'm able to run it through this just sounds better to me. Now I understand better is a subjective term but it's certainly more pleasing to my ears. I do hear room for improvement and will focus my mods on that espcially in the eq's. Could use a bit more bottom and the top could be smoothed out a little. I may just patch in my Neve Eq on the master sestion and call it a day.
We will be doing the discrete master section with Quad 8 inspired custom opamps and mci transformers. and see what needs improvement after that.

The Scum · Post by **The Scum** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:39 am

Sorry folks, you're not going to turn an old 200B into an API or Neve.

I could probably do it.

Though it might look more like an Opamp Labs in terms of overall architecture.

On a $5000 budget? Probably not. Not if my time is still worth anything to the instrumentation, data communication and automation crowds.

And about all that would be left of the original in the end would be the chassis and connectors...

And at the end, I'd still be left with a $300 Soundcraft 200B, and $4700(at least) of work and parts.

For $5000, there are more suitable starting points.

Nick Sevilla · Post by **Nick Sevilla** » Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:50 am

The Scum wrote:SNIP
For $5000, there are more suitable starting points.

Allen & Heath GL2800...

The Scum · Post by **The Scum** » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:50 am

Allen & Heath GL2800...

As a starting point for a transformer coupled, passive EQ, class-A beast?

It's no better a foundation than that 200B.

I was thinking along the lines of MCI 400, or Yamaha PM1000...depending on features and footprint.

Glory_Morris · Post by **Glory_Morris** » Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:02 am

Hey there's a ton of gear I can't afford out there but I have to run my business based on smart decisions and what will start paying for itself right away.

A smart decision would be to abandon this idea altogether.

Jim Williams · Post by **Jim Williams** » Wed Jan 23, 2013 8:10 am

To quote noted 20th century philosopher Frank Zappa:

"You are what you is".

No reason you can't work with what's there. Rewire the input into a trans-amp for one. Cut the 22k resistor from the inverting opamp input and tie it to the emitter of the transistor that feeds the inverting input. Then remove the 22k resistor and 100 pf cap from the non-inverting input to ground. Wire that resistor and cap from the emitter of the other transistor (the one that feeds the non-inverting input) to ground. Cut in 1/2 the value of the gain set resistor to make up the high gain.

Use some decent opamps like LME's or OPA's and it's a winner. Cleaner and smoother than any SSL or similar crap.

Just follow that other noted philosopher Dirty Harry:

"A man's got to know his limitations".

supafuzz · Post by **supafuzz** » Thu Jan 24, 2013 4:29 am

Jim Williams wrote:
No reason you can't work with what's there. Rewire the input into a trans-amp for one. Cut the 22k resistor from the inverting opamp input and tie it to the emitter of the transistor that feeds the inverting input. Then remove the 22k resistor and 100 pf cap from the non-inverting input to ground. Wire that resistor and cap from the emitter of the other transistor (the one that feeds the non-inverting input) to ground. Cut in 1/2 the value of the gain set resistor to make up the high gain.

Use some decent opamps like LME's or OPA's and it's a winner. Cleaner and smoother than any SSL or similar crap.

quote]
thanks Jim I'll pass this info along to my tech [also named Jim] I am already very happy using this console..and when we get a new power supply and fix things up I'm sure I'll like it even more. It just adds punch and depth that has been missing ITB. And yes I am awake now from the "turning the Chevy nova into a Ferrari dream. We can make this the best it can be and I can get back to work and be happy with what I have..[I know that's a tough one]. This is just a stepping stone to a real high end console..

supafuzz · Post by **supafuzz** » Fri Jan 25, 2013 5:08 am

well today is the day I pull some channels and the master section out in anticipation of the drive to Philly tomorrow to have Jim Kay from Matrix Audio Systems do some modifications..Jim has been taking care of my gear for almost 10 years and has custom built some amazing mic preamps that get used every session..he's modded almost everything that can be modded at super 70 studio.
Also picking up a 2nd 200b for spares and to possibly link 2 together for more goodness

Anyone with an empty 24 or 36 channel bucket??get in touch..

It's going to be a lot of driving now that I'm an hour farther from Philly...

Not sure if Jim's cheesesteaks on south street is open at 10am [different Jim] but I'm hopeful....

supafuzz · Post by **supafuzz** » Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:37 am

Went to Philly and met tapeopper Permanent Hearing Damage and picked up a soundcraft 200 for spare parts..unfortunately the 200 and 200B buckets are totally different..so Im looking for a 200B 24 or 36 empty frame to put everything together. But I'll be able to use the channel strips and the master section will go in my 200B temporarily while Jim Kay is customizing it. Turns out the caps are in great shape on mine and someone socketed the chips already in the master section so swapping them out will be a breeze...{Jim was telling me chip numbers and I just zoned out so I have nothing to report] We will be changing the shelves on the channel strips in the high end and low end to smooth things out on top and give a little more power n the low end.

So I've comeback down to earth regarding the potential of this and understanding what the real differences are in this console and the big classics. That said, it still is a step up from ITB...to my ears

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