What's your automation workflow?

[LupineSound]

Currently, I use an APC40 with Ableton to record automation. It's not great but it gets the job done. I was considering switching to Pro Tools and a Neve 8816 summing package but I'm unsure how I'd handle automation afterwards. Curious what you guys do...

[JGriffin]

At work I use an Avid D-Command control surface with ProTools 10. At home, a 002 with PT9.

[Recording Engineer]

I'm on PT. Over 10-years ago I got a Command 8, connected it, but never used it and eventually sold it. It always seemed I could put in the automation with a mouse much faster.

I still only use a mouse, but am curious if/what controllers people are using with PT and why.

[brenthahn]

I was considering switching to Pro Tools and a Neve 8816 summing package but I'm unsure how I'd handle automation afterwards. Curious what you guys do...

What do you mean by "afterwards?" After what?

[A.David.MacKinnon]

PT 9 over here but it's mostly getting used as a tape machine. The heavy lifting is done on the MCI. Different approaches for different records but in generally I'll ride vocal levels a bit in protools so I can hit the outboard gear without any huge spikes in volume. I mix analog (outboard effects and summing) and often send it back into protools as stems. If there are tons of moves to do I'll automate the stems.
I'm usually mousing around or using a presonus faderport. Both are fine for the limited job I need them for. If I was doing more in the computer i"m sure I'd want more faders.

[LupineSound]

I was considering switching to Pro Tools and a Neve 8816 summing package but I'm unsure how I'd handle automation afterwards. Curious what you guys do...

What do you mean by "afterwards?" After what?

After I switch from Ableton & APC40 to Pro Tools & the 8816.

[Nick Sevilla]

I love automation.

Learned on a Neve with Martinsound Flying Faders.

Now I have been using Avid (Euphonix) Artist Control and Mix surfaces to mix using ProTools HD, since about 2008. Love it.

I cannot possibly mix with a mouse. there is no way for me to be emoptionally involved with the music, connected to the music, unless it is with some faders under my fingers. Just not possible for me.

Cheers

[drumsound]

I have a Faderport, but haven't really warmed up to it. I think I may try it again on a project I'm doing right now. For getting the basic mix going I use the PT faders and have my console faders at unity. I think the big advantage of a DAW, when it comes to automation, is that you have the visual cues to help hone in on things. It's quite easy to see the loud part, get there, and make adjustments. Its also great to put mutes in, which can be quickly done. I think I'd like something with knobs for plug in EQ, but the mouse is just fine.

[Nick Sevilla]

Also,

I like to select a region larger than the song, and put the DAW into loop play. Give me about 2-3 seconds before the first note, and a longer ending, to listen to fadeouts / reverb tails / etc. at the end of the song.

As each pass happens, I work on a different instrument or section.

VERY IMPORTANT : without stopping play EVER to adjust anything. If you missed a cue, wait until the next pass. Sometimes you end up not needing to do that adjustment you thought was needed, because you listen to the whole context of the song. I have the Pro Tools in touch mode at this point of the process. And at the end, I use the touch mode, with the trim mode on (HD only), to make slight adjustments without affecting any crazy automation which might be ok.

I like to have a large notebook on hand with a pencil, to take notes while listening,
and then only start adjusting things on the next pass. I try to note only 2-4 things on each pass, and focus on them on the next go around.

It makes for a faster, less obscenely obsessive way of getting to a good mix.

Typically, I can do this for about 1/2 hr straight, then take a small break. Then go again.

[Sean Sullivan]

Nick's right on the money, working with acoustic music in particular that method works great. Get your EQ, panning and your general level where everything sits together nicely set (I usually do a crude volume automation when the instrument is taking a solo) and then go through the song instrument by instrument. Having a real fader makes this a lot more fun. I think the FaderPort is pretty handy, but of course the Euphonix stuff is super handy.

Using a summing mixer, I would just set up your busses, keep those levels at 0, and automate the level in Pro Tools feeding those busses, and print the two mix out of the summing mixer back into Pro Tools. That way, if you aren't in HD, and you wish after all that automation that the guitar was a DB louder, you can just turn up the buss.

[LupineSound]

Also,

I like to select a region larger than the song, and put the DAW into loop play. Give me about 2-3 seconds before the first note, and a longer ending, to listen to fadeouts / reverb tails / etc. at the end of the song.

As each pass happens, I work on a different instrument or section.

VERY IMPORTANT : without stopping play EVER to adjust anything. If you missed a cue, wait until the next pass. Sometimes you end up not needing to do that adjustment you thought was needed, because you listen to the whole context of the song. I have the Pro Tools in touch mode at this point of the process. And at the end, I use the touch mode, with the trim mode on (HD only), to make slight adjustments without affecting any crazy automation which might be ok.

I like to have a large notebook on hand with a pencil, to take notes while listening,
and then only start adjusting things on the next pass. I try to note only 2-4 things on each pass, and focus on them on the next go around.

It makes for a faster, less obscenely obsessive way of getting to a good mix.

Typically, I can do this for about 1/2 hr straight, then take a small break. Then go again.

Great advice! Thanks so much. I like the idea of looping the song and having objectives for each pass. I'm also gonna pick up one of those Artist Controls soon. Looks pretty handy.

[Injured Ear]

Nick, your method is very similar to my experience assisting Bruce Swedien. He did pretty much the same thing.



Conversely, my method is to often use the "Capture" and "Join" buttons in Protools HD automation so I can find optimum levels for specific sections by feel (too loud.. too soft.... just right [hits capture]) then punch that level in (join) for the start of the section.
Sometimes I just memorize the spot where the fader sounded best (no pencil marks like the old days) and make the move and then click "write to end" or "write to next breakpoint" or "write to all" depending on the application.

I really do like having faders and being able to close my eyes and find the level I want by feel instead of looking at the screen.

[Nick Sevilla]

Yes, he kind of was among the old school guys.
Because of the tape rewinding "ear break" time, they would make the assistant engineer just rewind and immediately press play when they got back to the top.

A 4 minute song would give you about 15-20 seconds of "ear break" rewind between each pass, time enough to reflect / take a note / make a decision / focus back on the top of the song. You literally could mix for hours like this, nonstop.

I did this a few times and found it quite useful. Still do it to this day, albeit the "rewind time" is shorter, more like 4-6 seconds. The first time I saw this done, was when I assisted for a big name producer, who did it this way. Fr the life of me I cannot remember his name. He mixed some stuff for a lot of pop artists in the 1980s and 1990s.

Cheers

[cjogo]

Total full- automation with the VS 2480 -- 48 channels at mixdown ..

[vvv]

FWIW, I like to start mixes on the Auratones. A couple of passes there concentrating on the rhythm section, then the vocals, then any leads and candy, and then switch to the main monitors (I use Tannoy 6.5 PBMII's) and back and forth to the Auratones within the next set of passes.

Then I wait a few minutes, and listen back on the main monitors.

I'm all ITB when mixing, so no automation, but thought it kinda relevant to some of the later posts in the thread ...

I've never tried the loop idear tho', and now I shall!