Recording a band separately vs all together (same room)

Balcony Falcon · Post by **Balcony Falcon** » Sat Dec 20, 2014 9:03 pm

I always find, for basic tracks, nothing beats the synergy of a group of musicians playing together in a context that they are comfortable in. Vocals etc., overdubs can all be done later, depending on track count

Free would play live, same room no isolation and Paul Rogers would sing, handheld, into a dynamic microphone in the monitor room with the monitors bleeding into his vocal mic and some of those records sound amazing, IMHO. Whatever works,

honkyjonk · Post by **honkyjonk** » Mon Dec 22, 2014 9:48 am

Free was Paul Rodgers? I didn't realize that.

This is a bit off topic, but one thing I've noticed when recording live (in myself) as well as other musicians is that mistakes are often not the worst part of a performance that includes a mistake. The worst part is what you play after the mistake while you're trying to hang in there but feel bummed out about what you just did and can't forget it.

The trick is to forgive yourself instantly if you can so you can get right back into killing it. If you can do that quick enough, often times the mistake doesn't even matter.

Injured Ear · Post by **Injured Ear** » Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:36 pm

The biggest problem I've encountered with bands recording together is when they don't have their tempos worked out well.

It *seems* like the drummer has lousy time but in reality what I keep finding is that the drummer follows whoever the bandleader is (usually the guitar player) who doesn't have great time, and as a result things speed up in the "awesome riff" sections and then slow down for the "difficult riff" sections and so things get fuckidy.

those are the only times I run into problems with bands all recording in the room at once. Most of my engineering career has been working with bands who were playing together in the room for a videotaped or televised live performance, and most of those bands had their sh*t together before things were booked.

but with the semipro stuff that I've mixed or recorded that had suck written all over it, it was a drummer who wasn't solid enough to lay down a tempo to make the rest of the band stick to it and instead followed the other players to get his tempos.

austin · Post by **austin** » Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:38 am

honkyjonk wrote:The trick is to forgive yourself instantly if you can so you can get right back into killing it. If you can do that quick enough, often times the mistake doesn't even matter.

Good life advice here, not just recording advice.

vvv · Post by **vvv** » Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:29 am

Injured Ear wrote: but with the semipro stuff that I've mixed or recorded that had suck written all over it, it was a drummer who wasn't solid enough to lay down a tempo to make the rest of the band stick to it and instead followed the other players to get his tempos.

Or ballsy enuff to take over. IMNSHO, that's my job as "producer" or even just as the recordist tryna make it better faster, to tell 'em, "let's record the drums first".

emrr · Post by **emrr** » Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:58 am

I am always most satisfied with the totally live projects. I've had several projects in recent years with everyone and amps all in the same room, live vocals, several takes, done. Maybe some master take edits, that's it. Nuancing the bleed is the most critical job, along with client education about what you can and can't get away with after the first pass. I had one acoustic quartet with vocal show up for live tracking with a new drummer in tow: wow. Luckily they were all good enough that they focused in on appropriate room dynamics, and captured workable takes. Some have virtually none of the drum mics in the mix, and the mix itself is a matter of finessing very small subtractive details to get the clearest picture. The vibe can just be unbeatable when this comes together. Sometimes the situation flips; the singer is the loudest one, even over the drummer, with vocal bleeding into everything else. Frequently master take edits save the day. Several loud rock band clients in the last few years have wanted the bleed to predominate, so we establish the sound of the main room pair first, with spot mics to reinforce. Make sure they all jive together, and it can then practically mix itself.

Drone · Post by **Drone** » Thu Dec 25, 2014 12:18 pm

emrr wrote:I am always most satisfied with the totally live projects. I've had several projects in recent years with everyone and amps all in the same room, live vocals, several takes, done. Maybe some master take edits, that's it. Nuancing the bleed is the most critical job, along with client education about what you can and can't get away with after the first pass. I had one acoustic quartet with vocal show up for live tracking with a new drummer in tow: wow. Luckily they were all good enough that they focused in on appropriate room dynamics, and captured workable takes. Some have virtually none of the drum mics in the mix, and the mix itself is a matter of finessing very small subtractive details to get the clearest picture. The vibe can just be unbeatable when this comes together. Sometimes the situation flips; the singer is the loudest one, even over the drummer, with vocal bleeding into everything else. Frequently master take edits save the day. Several loud rock band clients in the last few years have wanted the bleed to predominate, so we establish the sound of the main room pair first, with spot mics to reinforce. Make sure they all jive together, and it can then practically mix itself.

Recycled_Brains · Post by **Recycled_Brains** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 8:08 am

Did 2 live sessions last weekend. One had the bass amp isolated, but everyone was in the room, vocals were keeper takes. The other was set up like a show. Amps right next to the drums. Fun stuff. The vocal mics on the former proved to be pretty rad room mics for the drums. Happy accident.

emrr · Post by **emrr** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:18 pm

Sometimes I like an omni for vocals with drums in the room, so the drum bleed sounds better. A lot of times the isolation of a directional mic is not enough to overcome the sheer volume of a drum kit, and you still end up with every bit as much bleed, and it mixes strangely with the drum mics. Sometimes you can take the drums in a vocal mic down somewhat or at least tame them with either a fast attack/release limiter so it leaves the vocal mostly alone, or get mileage out of a high frequency limiter like a dbx 902 de-esser in high freq mode to control brash cymbals.

Sometimes that banjo is still too loud even after the guy has pulled out of the parking lot with it in its case.....

cjogo · Post by **cjogo** » Sat Mar 14, 2015 12:23 am

If I have the "right" room --all together >> for sure.https://soundcloud.com/cjogo/big-sur-brazila
https://soundcloud.com/cjogo/dark-chocolate-jam

BUT > I much prefer each person > playing separately ... 80% of our work is just a solo artist & then layering tracks after the facthttps://soundcloud.com/cjogo2/one-good-eye-new https://soundcloud.com/cjogo/dark-chocolate-jam

Judas Jetski · Post by **Judas Jetski** » Wed Mar 18, 2015 6:52 pm

Haven't heard too much in this thread about this technique, but it worked super-well for me the one time I tried it. I think a couple of youse guys was talking about it in principle, anyway.

http://messageboard.tapeop.com/viewtopi ... glyn+johns

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Recording a band separately vs all together (same room)

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