Sennheiser MD421

Recording Techniques, People Skills, Gear, Recording Spaces, Computers, and DIY

Moderators: drumsound, tomb

User avatar
vvv
zen recordist
Posts: 8952
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 8:08 am
Location: Chi
Contact:

Post by vvv » Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:02 pm

Using cotton to harsh the snare buzz, eh? :twisted:
bandcamp; vlayman;
THD; Geronimo Cowboys;
blog.
I mix with olive juice.

User avatar
Snarl 12/8
ghost haunting audio students
Posts: 3394
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:01 pm
Location: Right Cheer
Contact:

Post by Snarl 12/8 » Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:25 pm

Have you ever tried what I was introduced to as "trick tuning"?

Picture the lugs on the bottom of the snare. You tune the lugs tighter as they move away from where the snares are attached to the drum and looser as you approach the snare attached sides. This produces a slight dip in the snare skin under the snares. It really worked wonders for reducing those sympathetic snare vibrations.

The other approach is to never play with bass players or hit the toms which is my current mode.
Carl Keil

Almost forgot: Please steal my drum tracks. and more.

User avatar
Gregg Juke
cryogenically thawing
Posts: 3531
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:35 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Post by Gregg Juke » Sun Mar 26, 2017 3:27 pm

Other than those few mitigating tricks mentioned, it's really hard not to get sympathetic buzz if you are using a 12, 13, or 14-inch tom. Snares being 14-inches, you'd think a 14 tom would be bad, but my experience has been that the 13s are the worst.

Re: "cottonballs," I remember some guys used to do something similar with Kotex (tm); but that was more for tone/ring elimination. Not sure if it had to be that particular brand or not.

Re: "basketballs and bass drums," that soft-item-inside works great live too, miked or un-miked. I remember I used to use a smaller kick, maybe it was a 22? I didn't do much but put one of those ceramic discs on the beater side, put a small piece of foam and a blanket inside, and sometimes take the front head off. This is when everyone was putting three sleeping bags in their bass drums. Guys used to ask me "How do you get that kick sound?" (while looking right at the bass drum). I would say-- "Well, by taking the front head off, and putting a small piece of foam and a blanket inside."
"Hmm," would often be the incredulous reply.

GJ
Gregg Juke
Nocturnal Productions Music Group
Drum! Magazine Contributor
http://MightyNoStars.com

"He's about to learn the most important lesson in the music business-- 'Never trust people in the music business.' "

User avatar
Gregg Juke
cryogenically thawing
Posts: 3531
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:35 pm
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA
Contact:

Post by Gregg Juke » Sun Mar 26, 2017 3:34 pm

Gregg Juke
Nocturnal Productions Music Group
Drum! Magazine Contributor
http://MightyNoStars.com

"He's about to learn the most important lesson in the music business-- 'Never trust people in the music business.' "

drumsound
zen recordist
Posts: 6842
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:30 pm
Location: Bloomington IL
Contact:

Post by drumsound » Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:06 pm

I'm Painting Again wrote:
drumsound wrote:
I'm Painting Again wrote:this is my current technique for reducing the rattling of the wires

no treatment:

http://agatha-christie-fanclub.tumblr.c ... 8633640381

treated:

http://agatha-christie-fanclub.tumblr.c ... 8633525083

I quickly set it up without fine tuning for best performance and have the iPhone pointed at the bottom of the snare to intensify the effect all for a worst case example

you can hear the snares are less sensitive but it works Ok if you'd rather have less buzz..my dream is to have the snare like the un muted wires but the toms not rattle them :x
Is the second example just more cotton balls in the snare?
same amount..the bunch is slightly shifted due to flipping it over..takes away some of the internal ring of the shell like we have been discussing with the kick drum

also the cotton inside serves to dampen the bottom head slightly..works great with toms BTW..you could really fill it and have a much more drastic result though of course it would prob sound bad to most people

the difference here comes from a gossamer of cotton fiber betwixt the wires and the bottom head..the slightest compromise in snare sensitivity can reduce snare buzz significantly
Cool. I couldn't really tell looking at the video.

drumsound
zen recordist
Posts: 6842
Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:30 pm
Location: Bloomington IL
Contact:

Post by drumsound » Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:12 pm

A.David.MacKinnon wrote:
I'm Painting Again wrote:
A.David.MacKinnon wrote:The 602 is a funny one for me. I don't have tons of experience with it but there's one at a studio I've been working out of recently and I've given it a go a few times when I have drum sessions. It seems to me that the closer it is to the drum (like the traditional, partly in the hole placement) the more fake and ridiculous it sounds. The lows are insanely exaggerated and the mids seem non existent. As soon as I back it up a foot or more it sounds great and sits beautifully in the mix. I know this can happen to a degree with any mic but I've never heard it to this extreme.
I'm not complaining, once it's backed up a bit it sounds fantastic but it's a little weird. Any one else experienced this?
that's generally my experience as well - I keep it a foot back off a non-ported resonant head - i've never had much luck (in my space/ w my drum) with the popular kick mic in or near the little port situation - it comes down to how / why you record yr drums in a certain way - I need a booming kick with added attack and specific muffling for my kit's kick in my room for my methods to sound correct in the final drum mix

that said I've heard the close kick mic thing work wonderfully in other recording situations or with other drums

the game is listen and adjust what you have to work with to get the appropriate sound

what works here will not automatically work there

so choose yr mic based on what your sound needs and not particularly what mic is better in a vacuum
yeah. I never expect one size to fit all. My main point was that I've never really experienced such a drastic tonal change from a mic based on positioning. I always expect some changes from any mic based on proximity and placement but usually the mic retains it's fundamental character. With the 602 it's night and day. Moving it 6" makes it sound like a whole other mic.
I did a reallly fun quickie recording the other night, and I remembered what you guys have been saying about the 602. I decided to put it outside, but in front of the hole on my 22" BD. It sounded fantastic.

Listen here, just 2 drum mics!
https://wiplottheband.bandcamp.com/releases

User avatar
I'm Painting Again
zen recordist
Posts: 7050
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 2:15 am
Location: New York, New York
Contact:

Post by I'm Painting Again » Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:13 pm

ya cool !

that's exactly what my 602 sounds like on the Aquarian Regulator on the front of a 20" maple kick - in front of the hole or no where near it - looking through the hole gets that reverse head beater a little more of course

I suggest trying it on the beater side because that sounds SO fresh to me though that mic gets a lot of the under snare too and i HATE that - not easy to position but a beater side situation when it works is off the hook

also try the front with a booming non-ported head with that mic -

:hearts:

User avatar
A.David.MacKinnon
ghost haunting audio students
Posts: 3386
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 5:57 am
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Post by A.David.MacKinnon » Wed Apr 12, 2017 5:00 pm

I'm Painting Again wrote:ya cool !

that's exactly what my 602 sounds like on the Aquarian Regulator on the front of a 20" maple kick - in front of the hole or no where near it - looking through the hole gets that reverse head beater a little more of course

I suggest trying it on the beater side because that sounds SO fresh to me though that mic gets a lot of the under snare too and i HATE that - not easy to position but a beater side situation when it works is off the hook

also try the front with a booming non-ported head with that mic -

:hearts:
After using one at other people's studios I finally bought my own.

User avatar
I'm Painting Again
zen recordist
Posts: 7050
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 2:15 am
Location: New York, New York
Contact:

Post by I'm Painting Again » Wed Apr 12, 2017 8:31 pm

A.David.MacKinnon wrote:
I'm Painting Again wrote:ya cool !

that's exactly what my 602 sounds like on the Aquarian Regulator on the front of a 20" maple kick - in front of the hole or no where near it - looking through the hole gets that reverse head beater a little more of course

I suggest trying it on the beater side because that sounds SO fresh to me though that mic gets a lot of the under snare too and i HATE that - not easy to position but a beater side situation when it works is off the hook

also try the front with a booming non-ported head with that mic -

:hearts:
After using one at other people's studios I finally bought my own.
the 602 you mean ?

It's good for bass and keyboard amps too

try it there if you have not

pairs amazingly with Fearn VT-2 preamp for bass instruments..I imagine it would be good with any great tube pre in those applications

I haven't tried but i bet it would make a good snare mic too though you'd prob want to cut the lows some

User avatar
Leopold
buyin' a studio
Posts: 841
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 8:51 am
Contact:

Post by Leopold » Mon May 08, 2017 10:51 am

Check out the Avantone Mondo. I just got mine. It sounds really good to my ears. There are samples on this page of a ton of mics.

http://recordinghacks.com/2012/06/08/ki ... -shootout/

Eddie
"I raged against the machine and all this money came out!" Bart Simpson

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests