Question about monitoring / bass levels

[southsider]

Hey everyone, hope this post is in the right forum.

I recently got a pair of JBL 4311b speakers. They have excellent clarity and presence, but I feel like they're lacking bass.

I work out of a couple different studios. One uses NS-10m with a Yamaha NS-W2 sub. The other has NS-10m with no sub, and also Adam A8X. I've also worked on barefoot micromain 27s.

I bought the 4311 pair to be the alternate speaker in the first studio mentioned above with the NS10s and sub. Was looking for something for big loud playbacks but also to have another reference point for mixing. I had the speakers looked at by a speaker repair shop, and the woofers are working, in phase, and reading properly on the multimeter.

On my console's signal generator they do reproduce all the way down to the 20hz tone. They just lack the uumph that I'm used to from the sub or the Adam A8X or barefoots. I thought they would have a lot of 50hz thump, being that they have 12inch woofers. Another reference point is that I use JBL L100t speakers for home listening, which have a ton more low end (no eq or bass boost in the path).

Any thoughts on this? I suppose that they're working as they should, and that an old 70s era monitor may not the modern standard of super heavy bass?
Maybe I'm just used to a powerful but non-linear bass boost from the sub or modern monitors (adam and barefoot)?

Any input would be appreciated.

-Brad

[Nick Sevilla]

Hi Brad,

A few things to consider:

1. Where you place these speakers. Are they creating a null where you sit, in the low end? Possibly not fully in the null, but maybe in a valley?

2. The sweet spot of these speakers. Are they aligned properly to have the correct size sweet spot? Big sweet spot = less bass, less focus.

3. Do your other speakers make your chest vibrate? Maybe they are calibrated for too much low end?

4. What did your analysis of the room say, after you put in the new speakers? You did do a new room analysis, yes?

[vvv]

I know nothing about your JBL's but I would be very surprised if they have less bass than NS10's used w/out a sub.

That said, mebbe instead of comparing the speakers to other speakers, you might try comparing mixes that result as made on these, to mixes made on the other speakers.

As well, if you play different reference recordings, are the the differences between them discernible in a mix-useful way?

I offer these approaches from the standpoint that monitors needn't be the most pleasant of listening, just the most mix-useful.

I will add that I actually love the sound of my Tannoy SBM 6.5 II's, but I've now learned to start mixing (and even monitoring while recording) on my Auratones. The A's don't sound nearly as fun, but are giving me much better results when used first.

Even when compared on multiple other speakers!

[southsider]

Thanks for the input.

My analysis is a bit unofficial, but consists of playing pink noise off the console / pro tools with a LPF in/out to see how the bass reacts around different places in the room. In addition, I play back a bunch of songs that I'm really familiar with to hear the differences between speakers.

I meant to say that I have brought the 4311s to both control room, and in each room, they sound the same. Excellent clarity and mid range detail but lacking the low end extension that a sub gives, or that i can hear in headphones. (or that i get off the Adam a8x or micromain 27)

My plan is to re-cap the crossovers, and clean up the pots for the mids and highs. The diagram shows that the speaker sends full range to the woofer, so I don't think this will fix it, but may improve the higher end clarity, and maybe will give me a clue as to whats up in the process.

Being that they're both acting the same exact way, perhaps it's just normal. I'd say it would be unlikely if both of them had a problem that was causing the low end to respond exactly the same way.

[Snarl 12/8]

Not "enough" bass even with mid and treble turned down?
What happens when you really crank 'em?
I have some cheap as shit JBL stereo speakers that just sound better and better the louder you play 'em. You maybe mentioned that's what they were for anyway.

[Nick Sevilla]

Another possibility, is that the crossovers are shot.

But this would be rare if the sound is exactly the same on both, unless the same component no longer works on both. Not totally impossible.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/JBL-4311B-Cros ... Sw-qVax2wb

[southsider]

Hey everyone, thanks so much for the input.

I've taken more time with these speakers, and decided to try some mixes on them. It turns out the "not enough bass" issue is me just being used to bass at a certain level. I also did some homework, and it turns out my Yamaha Sub is designed to pair to a set of speakers that are smaller than NS10s, and require a larger and wider range bass boost, so I think I was hearing too much bass, but being used to it.

Once I get the mixes to sound "right" on the JBLs they translate nicely, especially for myself being new to these speakers.

Also, I took it a step further, and have re-capped one of the crossovers, and cleaned/excercised the pots. The high end of that speaker has really come to life. Looking forward to doing the other one.

And finally, yes, they seem to come alive when I turn them up a bit.

Thanks again for the input everyone.

[vvv]

Thanx for reporting back!