New Orleans style horn section

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New Orleans style horn section

Post by standup » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:28 pm

I'm in the planning stages for a recording this summer at a local "real" studio with a big room and a Steinway grand piano, which we'll need for this.

Two songs we're doing (I think) could use horns. One song is very New Orleans influenced, the other is more of a mid-60's soul tune vibe.

I'm thinking maybe just trombone and trumpet could make a part that would get it across.

What do y'all think? Or does it really really need to involve alto/tenor sax? The sound in my head could be trumpet & trombone...

Our budget is $0, players are splitting the cost, so I'm trying to keep it basic.

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by I'm Painting Again » Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:48 pm

look to the fundamentals

trombone c2 - f5
trumpet e3 - b5

this might limit you or be OK depending on the music

similar timbres will sound like one instrument - different timbres will create separation and the feeling of more instruments

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by The Scum » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:07 pm

I'm pretty sure some of that second line sound comes from people playing whatever was available.

For parade stuff, you can probably get away with just brass. Tuba is about the first thing I think of, but bass trombone can do it too. Maybe plus trumpet?

For the more soulful sound, a sax might be called for, perhaps paired with brass in different registers. Tenor + trumpet is the Memphis sound. Alto + bone is the Fred & Maceo thing. Heck, even loose overdubs of one trumpet could make an OK horn "section."
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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by I'm Painting Again » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:12 pm

also on a budget you can fill it out with samples/midi

works like a charm mixed under a couple real parts

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by standup » Tue Apr 30, 2019 5:19 am

The core instruments are piano/upright bass/drums, maybe electric guitar. The horns are accompanying that core, so I think switching to tuba for these brief sections would be too big a change.

I'm definitely not an arranger, and never have played horns in my life. Well, as a kid I used to mess around with my grandfather's trombone, but my focus has always been string instruments.

The piano player and I (I'm on bass) will talk about note choices and arrangement a bit, but the horn guys will have to work out the details of their harmonies.

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by markjazzbassist » Tue Apr 30, 2019 5:53 am

second line main elements are drum, bass/tuba, and melody. i think you'll be fine as long as that Upright is doing some second line Mambo lines (1 and 5 with walk ups/down) like the Tuba usually does. Trumpet and Trombone should be fine to do melody and counter point.

no need for a full horn section unless you're going for more of a brass band sound (rebirth, dirty dozen).

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by drumsound » Tue Apr 30, 2019 8:57 am

standup wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 5:19 am
The core instruments are piano/upright bass/drums, maybe electric guitar. The horns are accompanying that core, so I think switching to tuba for these brief sections would be too big a change.

I'm definitely not an arranger, and never have played horns in my life. Well, as a kid I used to mess around with my grandfather's trombone, but my focus has always been string instruments.

The piano player and I (I'm on bass) will talk about note choices and arrangement a bit, but the horn guys will have to work out the details of their harmonies.
If you're not writing charts, be sure to get players that are comfortable creating parts with your input. Many horn players are OK with that, but some are not.

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by roscoenyc » Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:13 pm

most of the "classic" sounds we love were done with one mic.

Most of the modern version of the classic sounds (Dap Kings) were done with one mic.

Get the best guys you can.

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by vvv » Tue Apr 30, 2019 2:50 pm

I'm Painting Again wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:12 pm
also on a budget you can fill it out with samples/midi

works like a charm mixed under a couple real parts
Don't do N'awlins, me, but when my sorta 80's things works horn sexions, that's how the guy does it, say live sax atop midi'd bones and trumpets.
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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by standup » Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:02 pm

We'll be in a decent size studio with a big room, so I'd like to do live horns and nothing MIDI. This place (Tonal Park, Takoma Park MD) has a Rhodes, a Wurli, and a B3 in addition to the Steinway, so all our keyboard flavors will be the real deal.

We're doing demos with a lot of MIDI elements, but for the EP I want real people playing real instruments. I know your average listener may not be able to tell, but that's how I want to do it.

I'm also looking for a violinist who has listened to Miles Davis if anybody knows DC area folks.

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by vvv » Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:31 pm

May I just say that I want every musician I work with to have and currently listen to Miles Davis.

And 'Trane, gotta have some 'Trane in there.

(Ornette is bonus.)

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by A.David.MacKinnon » Wed May 01, 2019 6:17 am

roscoenyc wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:13 pm

Get the best guys you can.
This. Even if you use a multi mic setup cut the section together and pay close attention to tuning.

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by I'm Painting Again » Wed May 01, 2019 9:38 am

standup wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:02 pm
We'll be in a decent size studio with a big room, so I'd like to do live horns and nothing MIDI.
great if you can pull it off then go for it !

I'll say don't discount augmentation with midi - actually try it - and compare the song with and without - it's cheap and easy to do and has the potential to enhance the art and sound perfectly natural

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by Mark » Sat May 04, 2019 9:16 pm

How would you guys assemble a N'awlins Funeral Procession/Sally Army style brass section?
WWRHS?

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Re: New Orleans style horn section

Post by drumsound » Sun May 05, 2019 3:33 pm

Mark wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 9:16 pm
How would you guys assemble a N'awlins Funeral Procession/Sally Army style brass section?
Do you mean placement in the space?

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