Blumlein!

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kayagum
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Blumlein!

Post by kayagum » Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:08 am

Now that I'm back in the basement to record again...

... I'm trying to record a solo acoustic guitar. I have a pair of Sterling ribbon mics in Blumlein (using the Cascade mic mount) about 6" from the 14th fret of my dreadnought.

Sounding pretty good (using a WA 412 into the new WA 2 buss compressor), with a wide stereo view. But on mono, clearly a phase problem (the low frequencies basically disappeared).

* What am I doing wrong?
* Should I care?

Earlier, I did a pair of XY condensors (modded Rode NT5) with a LDC (Oktava 219 Joly Mod) above it and got the same issue.

Might try doing a spaced pair, but I wanted to see what you all thought.
"Advice is what we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn't." ~ Erica Jong

"No one wants advice ? only corroboration." ~ John Steinbeck

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Recycled_Brains
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by Recycled_Brains » Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:04 am

I feel like that's going to be a problem no matter what with those techniques. I find there is room to pan toward the center with things like that, but not all the way. They're just not meant to be heard in mono.

IDK, maybe I'm wrong. I literally never check my mixes in mono.
Ryan Slowey
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Nick Sevilla
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by Nick Sevilla » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:20 am

When you sum two given microphones and the low end (or any other frequency range) disappears,
it means that you have one mic inside of a NULL for that frequency range.

Change the position of where you are sitting with the guitar, and try again. Move the mics to another position.

Test recordings are for exactly this purpose. So you can find the best place in your room to make the best
recording you can inside there.
Howling at the neighbors. Hoping they have more mic cables.

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Nick Sevilla
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by Nick Sevilla » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:21 am

To make a mix in Mono, using this Blumlein configuration:

You MUTE the side microphone, and keep the one facing the instrument.
Howling at the neighbors. Hoping they have more mic cables.

kayagum
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by kayagum » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:28 am

I'm such an idiot! (You all know that already)

I did a phase inversion on 1 channel, and it went away.

One of the mics was facing the opposite way.

I'm such an idiot! Carry on...
"Advice is what we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn't." ~ Erica Jong

"No one wants advice ? only corroboration." ~ John Steinbeck

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Nick Sevilla
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by Nick Sevilla » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:31 am

kayagum wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:28 am
I'm such an idiot! (You all know that already)

I did a phase inversion on 1 channel, and it went away.

One of the mics was facing the opposite way.

I'm such an idiot! Carry on...
"Carry on my wayward son..." ;)
Howling at the neighbors. Hoping they have more mic cables.

kayagum
ghost haunting audio students
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Location: Saint Paul, MN

Re: Blumlein!

Post by kayagum » Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:41 am

I have to say, it's now sounding pretty darn good. Now to dial back just enough compression.... (not much to begin with)
"Advice is what we ask for when we already know the answer but wish we didn't." ~ Erica Jong

"No one wants advice ? only corroboration." ~ John Steinbeck

drumsound
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by drumsound » Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:29 pm

Nick Sevilla wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:21 am
To make a mix in Mono, using this Blumlein configuration:

You MUTE the side microphone, and keep the one facing the instrument.
Blumlein is not M/S, though Alan Blumlein was the inventor (or on the team?) that came up with it.

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Recycled_Brains
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by Recycled_Brains » Thu Apr 09, 2020 9:38 am

kayagum wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:28 am
I'm such an idiot! (You all know that already)

I did a phase inversion on 1 channel, and it went away.

One of the mics was facing the opposite way.

I'm such an idiot! Carry on...
LOL. I've done dumber things (like posting as though I knew what was going on in this very thread). Glad you figure 8'd it out!
Ryan Slowey
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http://maggotbrainny.bandcamp.com

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Nick Sevilla
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Re: Blumlein!

Post by Nick Sevilla » Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:09 pm

drumsound wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:29 pm
Nick Sevilla wrote:
Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:21 am
To make a mix in Mono, using this Blumlein configuration:

You MUTE the side microphone, and keep the one facing the instrument.
Blumlein is not M/S, though Alan Blumlein was the inventor (or on the team?) that came up with it.
No, it isn't, still, whatever this OP was going, removing the "side" microphone would solve it. Well, that, and actually checking for phase.

LOL.
Howling at the neighbors. Hoping they have more mic cables.

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