Getting phase right on a drum kit

[drumsound]

Naw.

I don't really think absolute polarity is that big a deal, honestly. Some people say they can hear a difference, and logically it makes sense that one way should really be right/better but ehhhh.....compared to tuning the drums well and hitting them correctly I'd say it's low on the list of priorities.

For sure. I use octava MC012 on overs a lot. They might be pin 3 hot...

[digitaldrummer]

I would agree that it is probably in the 0.05% improvement category. but if you have a bunch of those tricks, maybe they add up to something that is perceptible...

[drumsound]

I would agree that it is probably in the 0.05% improvement category. but if you have a bunch of those tricks, maybe they add up to something that is perceptible...

True enough. That's pretty much the game we're in.

[Phobos]

So basically what we're saying here is that getting the relative polarity right on a multi mic'ed kit is MUCH, MUCH more important than absolute polarity on any one drum.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

Correct.

Just as far as absolute polarity goes....I have a bunch of records where I have several different masters, and I'll have them all in one session so I can quickly a/b them, cause this is the sort of thing dorky mastering engineers do...anyway, more often than not one of the masters will be reverse polarity from the other. You'd never know just from listening.

Maybe some outlier weirdo with super golden ears might be able to tell, but normal people listening to music like normal people do (i.e. not like a scientist) would never notice.

[Phobos]

Another question. Are low-frequency sound waves so long that moving the kick mic a little bit is not likely to yield any real change in the phase relationships with, say, the overheads? Or am I off-bass here?

[Nick Sevilla]

Another question. Are low-frequency sound waves so long that moving the kick mic a little bit is not likely to yield any real change in the phase relationships with, say, the overheads? Or am I off-bass here?

Off Da Bass.

Any movement will change the relationship of the RECORDED sound to each other.

If you move the one bass kick mic, it may work better with another mic, but not with the entire kit.

Because the sound wave will still hit the diaphragm at a different point in the sound waves phase.

[Nick Sevilla]

So basically what we're saying here is that getting the relative polarity right on a multi mic'ed kit is MUCH, MUCH more important than absolute polarity on any one drum.

You might mean relative PHASE (which is a number within 360 degrees).

POLARITY = Negative or Positive electrical current. Like the prong on your electrical outlet. One is positive, one is negative, and one would be groun (zero voltage).

PHASE = where in a circle ALONG THE TIME AXIS is your sound wave at? 360 degrees.

When you look at a phase scope, you are looking at your signal from IN FRONT of the time line, when you look at the DAW, you are looking at the sound from BESIDE the time line. You are looking at the time line from the NOW into the past on a phase scope. The phase scope has a delay on it to keep the image there long enough for your eyes to register it better.

The phase scope is basically turning your DAW screen 90 degrees counter clock wise, so you can see what the sound is doing along its X Y Z axes, and not the time axis. If you had another screen on the left side of your DAW monitor, and it had a phase scope there, you could more easily see what the sound does in 4 dimensions (x y z axes and time).

Now, as to the polarity of the microphones, I always want them all to be the same. You test this by having them all on, and do a test recording:

The initial transient of a hit should ALWAYS go in the same direction (up or down) on the DAW screen, on all microphones. That also makes it easier to phase align them as well. UP means positive voltage, DOWN means negative voltage. A few microphones are wired funny, especially older vintage ones. If you have one mic that is going the wrong way, use the PHASE switch on your console or mic preamp to flip if 180 degrees in the opposite direction, whichever is closest to the other mics.

[vvv]

PHASE = where in a circle ALONG THE TIME AXIS is your sound wave at? 360 degrees.

When you look at a phase scope, you are looking at your signal from IN FRONT of the time line, when you look at the DAW, you are looking at the sound from BESIDE the time line. You are looking at the time line from the NOW into the past on a phase scope. The phase scope has a delay on it to keep the image there long enough for your eyes to register it better.

The phase scope is basically turning your DAW screen 90 degrees counter clock wise, so you can see what the sound is doing along its X Y Z axes, and not the time axis. If you had another screen on the left side of your DAW monitor, and it had a phase scope there, you could more easily see what the sound does in 4 dimensions (x y z axes and time).

I love this!

[MoreSpaceEcho]

Another question. Are low-frequency sound waves so long that moving the kick mic a little bit is not likely to yield any real change in the phase relationships with, say, the overheads? Or am I off-bass here?

If by a little bit you mean an inch or so then yeah, it shouldn't make a huge difference in relation to the overheads.