Going for it

[jmann]

There are times that I've set up a dummy guide vocal mic just to be able to keep that sound if I dump the vocal.

good idea. I may setup 2 scratch vocal mics in the future -- one for vocals and one for "bleed". I've had times where the live vocal was good, but the singer wanted to punch in a single line or a couple words. As soon as you do that you lose the tone - there is just no way to match the bleed when you punch in an overdub -- unless you have the "bleed" mic setup. definitely will try that next time if I have an open channel.

This is a great idea!

[floid]

Bullet heater might help, and add a element of danger to get the band psyched.

NOW YOU'RE TALKING

Another option would be those little electric radiators, which put out decent heat and are (mostly) silent.

[A.David.MacKinnon]

Bullet heater might help, and add a element of danger to get the band psyched.

NOW YOU'RE TALKING

Another option would be those little electric radiators, which put out decent heat and are (mostly) silent.

I ran one of those in a 12 x 25 garage studio for years and years. It was just fine but it takes a while to get the room up to temp. I also used one of those electric micro furnaces if I needed to heat the room up quickly.

[Magnetic Services]

If you want to save an input, try miking the snare from the side! It emphasizes the sound of the shell but still picks up the snares pretty well. The attack from the head will still be in your overheads, anyway. Then, you can put that extra mic somewhere else (center of the kit above the kick is great for this kind of music, or add another room mic/amp mic, etc.)

[jmann]

If you want to save an input, try miking the snare from the side! It emphasizes the sound of the shell but still picks up the snares pretty well. The attack from the head will still be in your overheads, anyway. Then, you can put that extra mic somewhere else (center of the kit above the kick is great for this kind of music, or add another room mic/amp mic, etc.)

I was debating doing exactly this. Thanks!

[vvv]

My current collaborator frequently does top and side mic's on the snare.

I like it as I find less hash when I'm mixing.

Another thing I'll note is that he presents his drum tracks pretty dry, as I think he's recording in a small (20'x30'?) subdivided section of a Quonset-type barn that has stuffed and paneled walls, and carpet, and an acoustic ceiling.

When I want a bigger sound, using a global light-compressor/room-reverb on the buss I'll do like 15% on the overheads, 5% on the kick, 35% on the toms and then anywhere from 25-50% on the snare top (sometimes with a plate). (Snare bottom or side varies.) It works really well to sit the drums in a bigger room, and the snare blooms nicely on ballads at 50% or so.

But FWIW, whether it's top and side or top and bottom, I'll always use the top - not so much the others.

We just published this yesterday, and it's what I did.

[jmann]

UPDATE: We finally started tracking!

We're working in their (cold) practice space, with a low tin ceiling. But so far it sounds pretty good! My biggest issue is that I want to keep tweaking the mics even though we've got some keepers already. I should probably leave well enough alone, but I keep wanting to experiment to make things better...

[Nick Sevilla]

UPDATE: We finally started tracking!

We're working in their (cold) practice space, with a low tin ceiling. But so far it sounds pretty good! My biggest issue is that I want to keep tweaking the mics even though we've got some keepers already. I should probably leave well enough alone, but I keep wanting to experiment to make things better...

Cool.

The only real issue with changing microphones mid recording, is that when you go to splice different takes, you'll definitely hear a big difference.

I used to experiment, but would make changes only after a song was finalized, and do the changes on the next song. Helped keep the album sounding different from itself. Most musicians though, unless they are into having different drumkit sounds along their project, oppose this sort of thing.

[jmann]

Thanks, Nick. I think you're right and I decided to mostly keep things as-is in the interest of consistency. I'm excited to add a "wurst" mic on a future recording, but I think we're getting decent stuff right now so I'm not going to mess with it.

The only change I made was swapping in a dbx 560A on snare. I had been using the ART Pro VLA for kick and snare. The dbx seems way snappier and sounds good. Now running the bass cab mic through the ART, which I like as well.

[DrummerMan]

My only other advice would be to be careful about how far apart you space the instruments. Bleed will act as ambience so the farther apart you space things the more roomy and distant the bleed will be.

There's definitely been a couple times where I kicked myself because I was recording in a big space and I thought that more separation would give me a tighter sound (because in my head, I would have less bleed). But of course any reduction in bleed was made up for and then some by the space IN the bleed.

[A.David.MacKinnon]

My only other advice would be to be careful about how far apart you space the instruments. Bleed will act as ambience so the farther apart you space things the more roomy and distant the bleed will be.

There's definitely been a couple times where I kicked myself because I was recording in a big space and I thought that more separation would give me a tighter sound (because in my head, I would have less bleed). But of course any reduction in bleed was made up for and then some by the space IN the bleed.

Yep. I too learned that lesson the hard way (as I learn most lessons). The great thing about a bigger room is the sound doesn't bounce off the walls into all the other mics quite as much. You can put the players close and get more isolation out of gobos and mic placement than you would in a smaller space.

[DrummerMan]

My only other advice would be to be careful about how far apart you space the instruments. Bleed will act as ambience so the farther apart you space things the more roomy and distant the bleed will be.

There's definitely been a couple times where I kicked myself because I was recording in a big space and I thought that more separation would give me a tighter sound (because in my head, I would have less bleed). But of course any reduction in bleed was made up for and then some by the space IN the bleed.

Yep. I too learned that lesson the hard way (as I learn most lessons). The great thing about a bigger room is the sound doesn't bounce off the walls into all the other mics quite as much. You can put the players close and get more isolation out of gobos and mic placement than you would in a smaller space.

Totally. I record in big rooms so rarely and it's usually my session, that I forget or get distanced by other things. One day I'm sure I'll remember and do it right!

[drumsound]

Thanks, Nick. I think you're right and I decided to mostly keep things as-is in the interest of consistency. I'm excited to add a "wurst" mic on a future recording, but I think we're getting decent stuff right now so I'm not going to mess with it.

The only change I made was swapping in a dbx 560A on snare. I had been using the ART Pro VLA for kick and snare. The dbx seems way snappier and sounds good. Now running the bass cab mic through the ART, which I like as well.

Do you have a second Tape Op Ribbon? I've been using one in the wurst position a lot and it does amazing things to the BD sound. Better than the outside mic.

[jmann]

Do you have a second Tape Op Ribbon? I've been using one in the wurst position a lot and it does amazing things to the BD sound. Better than the outside mic.

I do! And right now neither of them is in use.

I'm using all Fireface's 10 inputs now, but I just realized I can probably use my Sound Devices Mix Pre as part of an aggregate device to get one or two more. (We'll see if my CPU can handle that...)

Or I just ditch the stereo overheads and go with mono, but that seems like it might be too big of a change... I guess I can always switch back...

[jmann]

BTW, in wurst position, do you tend to point the null of the ribbon up (toward the cymbal)?