Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by digitaldrummer » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:18 am

MoreSpaceEcho wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:01 am
this doesn't seem like a stretch to me, that Cars drum sound was the biggest/fattest sound going at the time, was it not?
I don't really hear that. there are the crazy "syn-drums" in there but the rest is pretty far from Def Leppard. to me it sounds more like late 70's early 80's muffled drums. but I wasn't there.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by vvv » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:20 am

digitaldrummer wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:52 am

have you noticed how many of the "newer" artists also play to clicks, and use backing tracks, or in some cases, don't even have a live band (or if they do it's just for show- i.e. air guitar and air drumming)
Wait, live? I mean, on TV, sure, but was that "air" thing being done in concert?
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by digitaldrummer » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:22 am

and it's not a recording trend - so yeah I'm going off topic - but WTF is it with everyone ruining perfectly good guitars when they "relic" them? stupidest trend ever. just had to get that off my chest...
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by vvv » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:24 am

MoreSpaceEcho wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:01 am
... that Cars drum sound was the biggest/fattest sound going at the time, was it not?

Mmmm - Genesis/Phil Collins solo
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by digitaldrummer » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:26 am

vvv wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:20 am
Wait, live? I mean, on TV, sure, but was that "air" thing being done in concert?
some of the artists at the Austin City Limits Festival (pre-pandemic) did show up with no bands. i don't get it but I don't listen to that style of music anyway. I also feel like so many "live" bands I see on SNL are just playing to backing tracks - they might be playing, but that's not what were hearing.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by vvv » Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:27 am

digitaldrummer wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:22 am
and it's not a recording trend - so yeah I'm going off topic - but WTF is it with everyone ruining perfectly good guitars when they "relic" them? stupidest trend ever. just had to get that off my chest...
I, also, loathe that.

And slightly different, but I was looking at one of the Joe Strummer sig Tele's at one point, and it looked cool ... to hang on the wall.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by joninc » Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:29 am

re: Mutt Lange

In his defense - the man has an incredible attention to detail and his productions are chock and block full of hooks. I'm not a fan of Def L at all but you can't listen to Shania Twain's UP and not marvel at is ABBA-esque level of pop song craft. I take issue as well with the idea that it's all a product of being edited to death - as though he didn't care about getting good performances at all... If that were true then anyone with a DAW could get his results by putting in the hours to edit enough. He clearly is obsessive and has a crazy high standard of "perfection" - whether you like it or not - it's not a product of laziness and there is something extremely appealing about a lot of his work. He apparently shook things up when he started working in Nashville with top level players who were used to banging through several tunes in a few hours were angry that he'd spend the whole 3 hours on carving out one main riff for a song.

He has very specific desires for his arrangements and parts and you can't really argue that they aren't effective ones.

It's kind of like how people diss pop songwriting and say "anybody could do that" - really? Prove it. We'd all be rich is that were true.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by digitaldrummer » Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:47 am

ok, back to the original topic... here's another thing that drives me nuts.

Signature plugins. And yes, this is probably mostly the fault of Waves... buy this plugin bundle and you can sound just like {insert name here}.
Marketing gone mad. And it's worse because there is one plugin for drums. And another for vocals. And another for guitars or bass. Because its magic. But most of the engineers putting their names on these worked on hardware consoles and outboard gear, but whatever.

this is definitely the "get off my lawn" thread.
Last edited by digitaldrummer on Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by vvv » Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:17 pm

The repeated use of attention-grab one-of samples as a hook.

For example, if I hear another car commercial use that ""go boy go" sample, I may go all Van Gogh on me.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by Scodiddly » Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:43 pm

digitaldrummer wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:52 am
Then again as pointed out earlier, many people (dare I say "kids") that grew up on that kind of music, now expect to hear that and maybe a band with a real band groove, would sound weird to them?
Never forget that the "kids" are also digging into their parents' record collections and sometimes being inspired by the oddest old things.

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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by drumsound » Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:26 am

MoreSpaceEcho wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:01 am
vvv wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:10 am
Even our in-jokes and proposed pranks are geeky.
:D :evil: :high: :mrgreen:

Was thinking about this thread last night, do you guys think that Cars' first record drum sound was the precursor to the much-hated Def Leppard drum sound? This doesn't seem like a stretch to me, that Cars drum sound was the biggest/fattest sound going at the time, was it not?
I think they're pretty freaking different. The first Cars record (a personal favorite) has what sounds like GIANT toms with no bottom heads, and some muffling. The snare is pretty in your face, but not followed but a Lexicon "hall." And there are a ton of examples that there was NO click to be found on that record, (maybe Moving in Stereo has an analog sequence).
digitaldrummer wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:18 am
MoreSpaceEcho wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:01 am
this doesn't seem like a stretch to me, that Cars drum sound was the biggest/fattest sound going at the time, was it not?
I don't really hear that. there are the crazy "syn-drums" in there but the rest is pretty far from Def Leppard. to me it sounds more like late 70's early 80's muffled drums. but I wasn't there.
This. The Cars is the bridge from the 70s to the 80s. They are the beginning of the change, but the drums are probably the least "new" sounding thing on that record.
joninc wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:29 am
re: Mutt Lange

In his defense - the man has an incredible attention to detail and his productions are chock and block full of hooks. I'm not a fan of Def L at all but you can't listen to Shania Twain's UP and not marvel at is ABBA-esque level of pop song craft. I take issue as well with the idea that it's all a product of being edited to death - as though he didn't care about getting good performances at all... If that were true then anyone with a DAW could get his results by putting in the hours to edit enough. He clearly is obsessive and has a crazy high standard of "perfection" - whether you like it or not - it's not a product of laziness and there is something extremely appealing about a lot of his work. He apparently shook things up when he started working in Nashville with top level players who were used to banging through several tunes in a few hours were angry that he'd spend the whole 3 hours on carving out one main riff for a song.

He has very specific desires for his arrangements and parts and you can't really argue that they aren't effective ones.

It's kind of like how people diss pop songwriting and say "anybody could do that" - really? Prove it. We'd all be rich is that were true.
As stated earlier I HATE Mutt Lange productions [that don't involve drunk Aussies] But I would NEVER in a million years call him lazy, or unfocused. I disagree with his choices of things to focus on, and the results they produce, but that's purely aesthetic. I think that lazer focus on "perfection" over Musical or Interesting is a detriment to the records and artists. 875 Billion people disagree with me, and that's fine.

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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by numberthirty » Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:12 am

One fellow's very particular grumble...

At some point, Glenn Danzig really took an interest in the "Nuts..."/"Bolts..." aspect of the "Recording..." component of his solo albums(seems like he even mentioned buying old Kustom amps in an interview...)

Every single one of those records since then has been a complete downer to listen to.

Only time in my whole like that I have ever consider volunteering my very humble recording skills because I honestly believed that they would make an album better in the end.

No clue how I would actually have accomplished doing so, but I sure did think it.

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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by MoreSpaceEcho » Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:09 am

joninc wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:29 am
It's kind of like how people diss pop songwriting and say "anybody could do that" - really? Prove it.
Yeah, one of my biggest pet peeves ever. Writing a good catchy pop song is one of the hardest things anyone can do.

Disagree? Let's hear your "Refugee".

RE: Cars/def lep drums.....obviously they sound totally different, seeing as the def lep drums aren't even real, but I was thinking of it in terms of "being a very produced sound", and just how prominent the drums are in the mix, how fat the snare is, those drums stand out to me compared to most other late 70s songs I can think of off the top of my head.

But listening to the cars on youtube right now on my laptop yeah I dunno haha! These drums sound pretty normal and 70s, except for the big tom fills.

This is funny though, check out 'best friend's girl', the drummer totally misses the first snare hit on the first chorus, there's just a wee rim click instead. And they left it! Amazing.

Getting back to Mutt Lange though, we should probably discuss his work with Foreigner. Who's gonna stick up for "I Wanna Know What Love Is?" :D

I do actually believe Foreigner were superior to their late 70s corporate bloat rock contemporaries. Juke Box Hero? Solid jam.

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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by vvv » Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:13 am

Roy Thomas Baker vs. R.J. "Mutt" Lange: discuss.
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Re: Recording Trends/Techniques that drive you nuts

Post by CraigS63 » Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:37 pm

vvv wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:24 am
MoreSpaceEcho wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:01 am
... that Cars drum sound was the biggest/fattest sound going at the time, was it not?

Mmmm - Genesis/Phil Collins solo
I'll see your Phil Collins drum sound, and raise with Bowie "Let's Dance", then Power Station "Some Like It Hot".

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