Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Recording Techniques, People Skills, Gear, Recording Spaces, Computers, and DIY

Moderators: drumsound, tomb

Mustang Martigan
takin' a dinner break
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 6:30 pm
Location: BOSTON, MA

Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Mustang Martigan » Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:04 am

When I record vocals n play my electric guitar (DI), I pick up a lot of the pick attack and it ruins the take.

I have the mic setup in my closet, with the back of the capsule pointing at a rack of clothes. I stand at the threshold, so I can lean my head in.

Is there any kind of trick to isolating the vocals, or will I just have to sing em solo?

Thanks.

User avatar
digitaldrummer
ghost haunting audio students
Posts: 3472
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:51 pm
Location: Austin, Texas
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by digitaldrummer » Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:11 am

you could try a super-cardioid mic, or maybe better yet a Fig8 for vocals, where you have the null pointing at the guitar. you may have to experiment with it. or try one of those isolation panels between the guitar/vocal mic. But if the mic is capturing reflections (of walls, closet door, etc), then you have to stop that too.
Mike
www.studiodrumtracks.com -- Drum tracks starting at $50!
www.doubledogrecording.com

User avatar
Recycled_Brains
resurrected
Posts: 2342
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 6:58 pm
Location: Albany, NY
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Recycled_Brains » Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:24 am

Mustang Martigan wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:04 am
When I record vocals n play my electric guitar (DI), I pick up a lot of the pick attack and it ruins the take.

I have the mic setup in my closet, with the back of the capsule pointing at a rack of clothes. I stand at the threshold, so I can lean my head in.

Is there any kind of trick to isolating the vocals, or will I just have to sing em solo?

Thanks.
What mic are you using? Something like a 441 or SM7 probably wouldn't pick up as much picking.

Can you hear it in the mix, or just when the vocal is solo'd?
Ryan Slowey
Albany, NY

http://maggotbrainny.bandcamp.com

User avatar
Rodgre
carpal tunnel
Posts: 1744
Joined: Fri May 30, 2003 3:19 am
Location: Central MA
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Rodgre » Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:10 am

Recycled_Brains wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:24 am
SM7 probably wouldn't pick up as much picking.

Can you hear it in the mix, or just when the vocal is solo'd?
I was going to say this. The SM7B has been great in this setting for me. Any decent super-cardioid mic will help, especially if you're close to it.

Like Recycled Brains asked, is it ruining the take when you listen to everything together, or just soloed?

I often find that I LIKE getting the added attack of hearing a mic'd electric guitar. So much so that I do it on purpose sometimes.

Is it possible to just redo the vocal track once you have the guitar down? Is it imperative to have both done in one live take?

Roger

User avatar
vvv
zen recordist
Posts: 10136
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 8:08 am
Location: Chi
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by vvv » Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:25 am

I know a guy who mics the elec guitar acoustically just to get the pick attack.

Of course it's a consideration if it interferes with vocal comp/editing ...
bandcamp;
blog.
I mix with olive juice.

Magnetic Services
suffering 'studio suck'
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:21 pm

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Magnetic Services » Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:38 am

A few things to try:

-Dynamic mic super close to your face

-Narrow-pattern mic with the null pointed at the guitar

-Use a transient shaper plugin to reduce pick attack

-Place some mass between your head and the guitar, like a piece of wood.

If all else fails, use RX!

stephenbrooke
audio school
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2011 2:23 pm
Location: Florida Panhandle
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by stephenbrooke » Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:21 pm

vvv wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:25 am
I know a guy who mics the elec guitar acoustically just to get the pick attack.
That was one of Buddy Holly's tricks.

User avatar
roscoenyc
carpal tunnel
Posts: 1530
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:56 pm
Location: NYC
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by roscoenyc » Thu Apr 29, 2021 7:00 am

Sometimes Figure 8 can work even better than a hypercardiod pattern.
Aim the null directly at the guitar.
I forget to try this usually but I did it yesterday to great result.

Mustang Martigan
takin' a dinner break
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 6:30 pm
Location: BOSTON, MA

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Mustang Martigan » Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:59 pm

Recycled_Brains wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:24 am

What mic are you using? Something like a 441 or SM7 probably wouldn't pick up as much picking.

Can you hear it in the mix, or just when the vocal is solo'd?
MCA SP1.

Yes, it's in the mix and LOUD. I can here the entire riff as well, but it's the annoying, sometimes ear piercing, sound of the pick attack that kills me.

Mustang Martigan
takin' a dinner break
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 6:30 pm
Location: BOSTON, MA

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Mustang Martigan » Thu Apr 29, 2021 1:01 pm

vvv wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:25 am
I know a guy who mics the elec guitar acoustically just to get the pick attack.

Of course it's a consideration if it interferes with vocal comp/editing ...
I do like what it adds, for certain songs.

When I do decide to use it, I want it on it's own track, probably with the drum/percussion reverb. I also want to try recording it with an acoustic...to see which sounds better, if not both blended.

Mustang Martigan
takin' a dinner break
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 6:30 pm
Location: BOSTON, MA

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Mustang Martigan » Thu Apr 29, 2021 1:05 pm

Magnetic Services wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:38 am

-Place some mass between your head and the guitar, like a piece of wood.

If all else fails, use RX!
Any suggestion on how to prop up the barrier?

I've tried RX (I only have Elements tho). I use Click, and start with the Random Clicking preset.

I first turn sensitivity up to around 8. If it's really bad, I'll make two instances, one all the way LF, and the other all HF.

It definitely helps, but doesn't fix the problem.

User avatar
digitaldrummer
ghost haunting audio students
Posts: 3472
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:51 pm
Location: Austin, Texas
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by digitaldrummer » Thu Apr 29, 2021 1:21 pm

The MCA SP1 is cardioid, but as with many LDC mics, it picks up everything! As mentioned, an SM7B (or many Broadcast mics) would be much more directionally focused. Even an SM58 would probably pickup a lot less of the pick sound, but depends on the sound you are going for. Or try a mic that has a Fig-8 capability.

Many of the mic isolation products just mount off a mic stand. there are many brands out there (Auralex, sE, etc.) . I have one from Primacoustic. Even Monoprice makes one (or more).
Mike
www.studiodrumtracks.com -- Drum tracks starting at $50!
www.doubledogrecording.com

Magnetic Services
suffering 'studio suck'
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:21 pm

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by Magnetic Services » Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:00 pm

Mustang Martigan wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 1:05 pm
Magnetic Services wrote:
Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:38 am

-Place some mass between your head and the guitar, like a piece of wood.

If all else fails, use RX!
Any suggestion on how to prop up the barrier?

I've tried RX (I only have Elements tho). I use Click, and start with the Random Clicking preset.

I first turn sensitivity up to around 8. If it's really bad, I'll make two instances, one all the way LF, and the other all HF.

It definitely helps, but doesn't fix the problem.
Try doing spectral edits right on the spectrogram (in standalone mode or via RX Connect). You should be able to see exactly where the picking sound is, select that range throughout the entire track, and use simple gain reduction to minimize the picking. There's also a "Repair Assistant" which might help you out.

Minimizing the picking noise during recording is still a better option, though. It sounds silly, but you could try kneeling at a desk or table so the wood forms a barrier between your guitar and mic, or rig up a piece of wood at standing height with clamps.

You could also try recording the picking noise with a dedicated mic and reversing the polarity so that it cancels out the noise in your vocal mic.

User avatar
A.David.MacKinnon
ears didn't survive the freeze
Posts: 3818
Joined: Wed May 07, 2003 5:57 am
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by A.David.MacKinnon » Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:16 pm

Figure 8 with the null pointed at the guitar. There's a reason that a two figure 8 set-up is the go to for singer songwriter gigs. It's the best isolation you can get.

kslight
mixes from purgatory
Posts: 2968
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:40 pm

Re: Isolating Vocals when Recording with DI Electric Guitar

Post by kslight » Thu Apr 29, 2021 3:41 pm

Besides above, do you have another guitar with dead strings or that you could string with flats?

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 35 guests