Embedding RIFF tag info in wav files / Sirius XM upload guidelines?

[alexdingley]

I have an artist who's just finished a comedy record, and they're putting it up through Sirius XM, they're hoping to upload the content tomorrow. I handed over the files 3 weeks ago, but at the 11th hour, they're asking a question about file tagging for which I can't easily find the answer. It's a weekend, so I'm having trouble getting folks (label-wise) to return emails, and I'm wondering if anyone out here knows more about the file upload guidelines for Sirius XM.

3 weeks back, I handed over final WAVE files 24bit / 44.1KHz — and I used an MP3 tagging app (mp3Tag.app) to embed ID3 Tags... but I'm not sure those are "properly" embedded. All the tags read back when I re-open the WAV files in mp3Tag.app, but (now that I've tried them elsewhere) if I throw those wav files into Apple's Music.app, none of them read the metadata back at all. The client's liaison just suggested (something I'd not heard before) "the RIFF info is blank"... She opened the files up in Adobe Audition and showed me a screen shot of the "RIFF info" panel, which (as she indicated) shows no ISRC codes.

I have not (in a fair amount of web searching) found any elegant ways to embed individual track ISRC codes and the overall album Barcode into the .WAV files. From what I can tell the RIFF info is a portion of the .WAVE file standard... but I can't see ANY ways to have my files save WITH that info. RIFF isn't referenced in the manuals for most of the apps I've used. It seems that the ID3 tags aren't the same thing / don't translate over inherently. So I have to do one of two things:

1. Figure out how to embed the ISRC & Barcode info into my WAV files (using some kind of RIFF editor)
2. (if the above is not easily done) Verify that some other (more easily tagged) format can be provided to SiriusXM... like can we provide them with FLAC files? (does anyone here have any "Upload guidelines" for SXM?)

[The Scum]

I might point you at some more "hacker-level" tools.

It sounds like a fundamental question is whether the RIFF data is preserved as the files get passed around between other applications.

It would help inform things if you had a way to get an example file that's been processed correctly.

There was a header display utility that integrated into Finder/File Explorer called "MediaInfo," but it turned into spyware, so be extremely careful there. It used to be necessary when deciphering video files, as some of them are like 4 containers deep, with an MPEG stream hidden deep inside, if you can locate it.

You can view the file on the command line with a tool like "xxd" to see the raw binary and an adjacent ASCII decode. The ASCII might show the tag names and their content. I think the RIFF data should all be near the start of the file (starting 44 bytes in?).

There's also SoX and SoXi - SoXi displays info about various media files, and you might be able to conjure the switches & flags to get it to attempt to decode the RIFF data. Then SoX might let you tweak the values - this is all low-level hacking, though.

I think xxd is standard on Mac & Linux. SoX is in the homebrew/apt landscape.

It looks like there are Python libraries that will let you see/edit the RIFF data, but that might be a higher degree of hacking than you seek.

[The Scum]

And perhaps to clarify one of the fundamental points:

Regular Wav file headers contain the basic data some an application can decode the data - sample rate, bit depth, encoding, etc. Basic nuts & bolts stuff required to play the file correctly. It also provides the means to sneak more data in between the Wav header and the actual data stream - RIFF gets tucked in there.

RIFF is higher-level metadata, with a bunch of optional fields that can be added - title/artst/label/ISRC among them. Since it's optional, it's self identifying, with a standard tag name (a 4-character codename, see link above), and a user configurable value (I assume ASCII text).

If you export a wav from Audacity, I know it gives the option to populate "metadata," and you can configure a template for it. I'm assuming that's RIFF header. I dismiss that dialog without filling it out dozens of times a week...

[The Scum]

Out of curiosity, I just made an Audacity file with a sine wave in it, exported it, filling out the metadata, then went hunting for it. xxd found it.

It's at the very end of the file, in this case (not that it couldn't be at the start of the file, it's just a matter of indexes in the wav header).

I assume the capital I & T things (IPRD, IART, ICRD, TRCK, ...) are the tag names, and the things next to them the ASCII values (qwerty, ascdxwed, 777, 888, etc)

0107ac20: 09fb d8fb b1fc 82fd 57fe 2dff 4c49 5354 ........W.-.LIST
0107ac30: 5a00 0000 494e 464f 494e 414d 0800 0000 Z...INFOINAM....
0107ac40: 6173 6466 6768 0000 4950 5244 0a00 0000 asdfgh..IPRD....
0107ac50: 6173 6463 7873 7765 6400 4941 5254 0800 asdcxswed.IART..
0107ac60: 0000 7177 6572 7479 0000 4943 5244 0400 ..qwerty..ICRD..
0107ac70: 0000 3838 3800 4947 4e52 0400 0000 6664 ..888.IGNR....fd
0107ac80: 6500 4954 524b 0400 0000 3737 3700 6964 e.ITRK....777.id
0107ac90: 3320 7600 0000 4944 3304 0040 0000 006c 3 v...ID3..@...l
0107aca0: 0000 000c 0120 0506 6705 531a 5452 434b ..... ..g.S.TRCK
0107acb0: 0000 0004 0000 0037 3737 5441 4c42 0000 .......777TALB..
0107acc0: 000a 0000 0061 7364 6378 7377 6564 5450 .....asdcxswedTP
0107acd0: 4531 0000 0007 0000 0071 7765 7274 7954 E1.......qwertyT
0107ace0: 4452 4300 0000 0400 0000 3838 3854 434f DRC.......888TCO
0107acf0: 4e00 0000 0400 0000 6664 6554 4954 3200 N.......fdeTIT2.
0107ad00: 0000 0700 0000 6173 6466 6768 ......asdfgh

[alexdingley]

Okay wow... hacker-level sounds about right.

My question is: "if this is what's required to embed those tags, then are they NOT commonly used?" — I mean to say: If using the RIFF architecture's tagging is the expected norm, then wouldn't it be pretty much a default thing in the file export of EVERY pro audio file editor / handler?

[Nick Sevilla]

My experience with XM has been weird. I have been engineering a client's XM show for over 12 years now. It used to be fun, lighthearted etc. Then the suits came in with :

1. You cannot EVER speak over music, not even a bed.
2. The music HAS TO BE FULLY CLEAR OF ANY VOICEOVER.
3. You HAVE TO CHOP THE SHOW INTO VOICEOVER / MUSIC.
4. YOU MAY NOT EVER NEVER EVER EVER PLAY MORE THAN ONE SONG FROM ANY ONE ARTIST.

They sucked the fun, out of the show. They are building a music database, and they do NOT WANT TO PAY ROYALTIES. Thus the requests to have the music totally clear of any spoken words over it.

Our solution? We now have our own database of songs, limited to the same 80 or so ones, and never any new ones. LOL.

So, I don't do any other work for XM. Bunch of moochers. they were already bankrupt once...

[alexdingley]

eeeesh... well that's no fun at all. Thankfully I'm not doing anything that involves music, with them. It's just stand-up comedy. That said; I'm still waiting on a reply back (but I don't anticipate hearing back until after the July 4th holiday) about a tech spec for content, tagging-wise.

[MoreSpaceEcho]

I don't even know what RIFF tags are, but if you just need the ISRCs and barcodes added into the metadata of the wavs, I can do that for you in Wavelab in like 2 seconds. I'm around all day today, just PM me if this would be helpful.

[The Scum]

Be careful with that space echo guy. He might embed riff-raff tags!

[MoreSpaceEcho]

More likely I'd just overdub some killer riffs.

[CraigS63]

My experience with XM has been weird. I have been engineering a client's XM show for over 12 years now. It used to be fun, lighthearted etc. Then the suits came in with :

1. You cannot EVER speak over music, not even a bed.
2. The music HAS TO BE FULLY CLEAR OF ANY VOICEOVER.

I've heard a lot of surf/instro music being talked over on Underground Garage, and MTV's Alan Hunter talks over intros of songs on the 80's channel there. Hope I didn't just incriminate them.

[digitaldrummer]

My experience with XM has been weird. I have been engineering a client's XM show for over 12 years now. It used to be fun, lighthearted etc. Then the suits came in with :

1. You cannot EVER speak over music, not even a bed.
2. The music HAS TO BE FULLY CLEAR OF ANY VOICEOVER.

I've heard a lot of surf/instro music being talked over on Underground Garage, and MTV's Alan Hunter talks over intros of songs on the 80's channel there. Hope I didn't just incriminate them.

I think maybe that's the whole point - they don't want anyone else to speak over it so their DJ's (or whatever they are) can. And they don't want to pay royalties - yet they charge a "royalties" fee in every subscription - that's probably just paying for the lawsuit a few years back.