crappy compression

[SecondSon]

So I used to run my vocals through a Behringer mdx2600 before tracking, but then a guy that is far more experienced than I told me to use the compressor in my preamp (Art pro channel). Since I tried this, I swear I am really not getting any compression at all. If I slam the threshold, it sounds like ass. If I let the compressor do about 3-8 Db of compression, it really doesn't get any handle on the vocals at all. I never had this problem when I was using the behringer. Anyone else had this problem, is this an ART thing?

[greatmagnet]

Yeah, I am a little. I have the ProChannel and feel like in some ways I'm still getting a handle on it and am not sure if I'm using it correctly. It seems very hard to get a clean, un-fuzzed signal through the preamp for one, but I think I've got that handled for now.

In terms of compression, I generally really like the sound of opto-compressors and you have to understand that unlike Behringer-type compressors they can do their job without really sounding tlike they are turned on so much. In other words, if you listen to your peaks or lack thereof you'll realize it's doing it's job without sounding all squashed.

That said, I do find the ART one to be rather subtle until you turn the ratio way up. I usually just keep my threshold ALL THE WAY TO THE LEFT as a starting pojt and turn up the ratio from there. Although it sounds extreme I agree with you that it's over-subtle so I guess this is the way to start. The opto-compressor in my cheapass $200 Bellari tube preamp kicks the ART's ass even though it's a noisier preamp. I like that thing way better overall.

Don't even get me started on the ART ProChannel's TUBE compressor. That thing just flat out does not seem to work. Maybe I'm doing something wrong?

[@?,*???&?]

If you're tracking into the digital domain with a DAW situation, then try using an onboard compressor/limiter as a plugin for tracking. I've found the initial signal to be cleaner and you can always run the sound back out of the box later for some analog compression. Don't getme wrong here, I love the sound of tape- when tracking a band, but I have really grown to love the clarity of digital for vocals. It has exposed so many things I used to once deem the sound of tape- a bad capsule or a singer overloading at the mic becomes clear very quickly whereas in the analog realm that was all once obscured. I have currently been running tracks on a project I am in the middle out of Pro Tools through a few tube devices I have just for the tonal color of the tubes. It's been the right thing for about 1 in 5 sounds.

[puffpastry]

In terms of compression, I generally really like the sound of opto-compressors and you have to understand that unlike Behringer-type compressors they can do their job without really sounding like they are turned on so much.

Right--one of the inherent problems with cheap VCA compressors is detection error. In order for the VCA to operate, the detection circuit has to accurately detect audio (AC) and rectify it into a DC control voltage. Depending upon how the detection circuit is designed, you can see errors with low-frequency, low-level, or transient signals, and this translates into distortion in the audio signal (ever wonder why your VCA compressor distorts on kick drums? Or why, when you nuke the signal, it kills all of the tone?). Since Opto-compressors don't operate this way, they don't have these artifacts.

Also, opto-compressors are slower, so the knee is much softer, and the characteristic of the compression is smoother.

A well designed VCA compressor won't have these kinds of problems because a good detection circuit won't be as susceptible to these errors.

[swingdoc]

Dont mean to get my nose brown, but puff, that may have been two of the best paragraphs on this board in months...

cudos!

[greatmagnet]

Dont mean to get my nose brown, but puff, that may have been two of the best paragraphs on this board in months...

I second that. Concise, clear, and informative. I knew opto was rad but not why. Thank you.

Speaking of cheapass compressors, here's what I plan to spend my next $215 on: Black Lion Audio makes a $115 mod kit with parts and easy instructions to turn your shitty Alesis 3630 into a totally kickass compressor. Assuming you get your 3630 for $100 (or less on eBay) you're spending peanuts for FOUR CHANNELS of really decent compression. This kind of thing is great for us poor-ass home studio guys. Naturally I found out about this from the TapeOp message board.

http://www.blacklionaudio.com/alesis_36 ... ations.htm

[wing]

Don't let any other Art stuff sway you from the Art Pro VLA, which is an amazing compression unit. I love it.

[greatmagnet]

Wing, do you know if the Pro VLA is identical to the compressor in the ProChannel, or if compromises were made in the ProChannel version? Superficially their controls appear the same, and the ad hype claims that the ProChannel is a combination of the MPA and the VLA.

But, as previously discussed, the ProChannel's compressor seems a bit finicky, so I had ta ask.

[dwelle]

the 3630's are two channel...

[greatmagnet]

While I'm on the subject, can someone tell me what VCA and VLA stand for???

I should really know this by now.

[greatmagnet]

the 3630's are two channel...

Oops! My bad.

[dokushoka]

If you're tracking into the digital domain with a DAW situation, then try using an onboard compressor/limiter as a plugin for tracking. I've found the initial signal to be cleaner and you can always run the sound back out of the box later for some analog compression. Don't getme wrong here, I love the sound of tape- when tracking a band, but I have really grown to love the clarity of digital for vocals. It has exposed so many things I used to once deem the sound of tape- a bad capsule or a singer overloading at the mic becomes clear very quickly whereas in the analog realm that was all once obscured. I have currently been running tracks on a project I am in the middle out of Pro Tools through a few tube devices I have just for the tonal color of the tubes. It's been the right thing for about 1 in 5 sounds.

This kind of defeats the purpose with tracking with compression, no? I mean, the plug in is post converter, so you are still gonna get overloads going into the converter...

I would suggest, unless you have a really nice compressor, just track with 24 bit and leave like six to eight db of headroom, then compress it later with your plugs.

[puffpastry]

Dont mean to get my nose brown, but puff, that may have been two of the best paragraphs on this board in months...

Thank you, that's very kind of you to say that.

While I'm on the subject, can someone tell me what VCA and VLA stand for???

VCA stands for Voltage Controlled Amplifier (or Attenuator). I've no idea what VLA means.

Assuming you get your 3630 for $100 (or less on eBay) you're spending peanuts for FOUR CHANNELS of really decent compression.

You can easily get two used 3630's for a little over $100 on Ebay.

The 3630 is a good example of poorly designed detect circuitry--to the point that it's unuseable as a compressor IMO. One of the things I did with the Black Lion mod was to change the 3630's detect circuitry so that it has a more musical, error-free detect release rate. That way, the VCA can actually compress signal smoothly, without pumping and distorting--even when totally squashing the signal. I changed the gain structure of the knee as well, so it's softer, more like an optical style of compression.

[rhythm ranch]

While I'm on the subject, can someone tell me what VCA and VLA stand for???

VCA stands for Voltage Controlled Amplifier (or Attenuator). I've no idea what VLA means.

VLA = Vactrol Leveling Amplifier.

From an ART press release:

Similar in design philosophy to classic tube limiters, the PRO VLA utilizes a VCA-less design for premium performance. The PRO VLA design features an electro-optical (Vactrol) and vacuum tube electronics which deliver vintage sound without added noise. It is this circuitry combination that gives the PRO VLA its warm, vibrant sonic flavor reminiscent of classic compressor/limiters.

[greatmagnet]

You people fucking RULE!