Bass Compression, A primer...

[Red Rockets Glare]

Is there a general place to start as far as attack and release times with an electric bass compression? What about threshhold?
I know the attack is where you can vary the tone, but where do you start at?

[@?,*???&?]

I've put the e-mail in to Joe Chiccarelli to begin participating in this messageboard, but I guess he's not out there yet. While I could tell you how I go about compressing low end, Joe is the king of 50hz!

[Red Rockets Glare]

bump

[joeysimms]

Try -

Attack: 4 to 10ms
Release: 10ms
Threshold: -2 to -10db
Ratio: 4:1 to 12:1

And then fiddle around til it sounds right.

[soundguy]

why are you compressing a bass?

Until you answer that question, you are playing with yourself asking for advice as there are about a billion different reasons to stick compression on a bass. And obviously, every decision you make turing a knob will all relate to the sound that you want to make, so again, you pretty much need to know what sound you want to hear.

If you cant come up with answers to those two points, you dont know what you want. This is not always a bad thing, the best experiments come from that position. Put up your mix, plug in a compressor and turn the knobs. When it sounds good to you, it is good. Write down what you did and save it in a drawer. The next time you mix, turn the knobs till it sounds good and write down your results and compare. Once you've notated 20 or 30 different mixes and can compare what you did on each one, you can start to see the pattern that emerges and then try THAT first and see where it puts you. Taking good notes on every knob setting is one of the most important things you can do when you are figuring this stuff out. Looking at a knob on 10 often doesnt have the impact that looking at those same settings on a piece of paper will do. I often dont catch some mistakes until I go to make my notes. Maybe thats just how my brain works...

Generally speaking, if you dont have a good sounding compressor, dont even think about bass compression. The lst thing your bass needs if it is having trouble sitting in a mix is more mud and slew distortion from a shitty compressor. Your threshold is the point where the compressor starts compressing, so if you want the whole bass in the compressor, set it low. If you just want the peaks even off so you can sit the bass behind other stuff, set it high. The attack will determine how much dynamics stick out of the compressor and your release will dtermine how much bounce the track will have. You also dont want to overlook the KIND of compressor to use, but perhaps thats a different conversation. Ultimately, you have to use what you have available and you really need to listen, in all cases, on how to make it sound the best. I would almost guarantee that whatever you found to sound good for john paul jones is probably not going to be the way you want to have your compressor set if you are recording flea. bass compression is about as general of a question as how do I cook food. If you can provide more info, I bet we can give you a more detailed answer. Certainly, for instance, the way you'll compress a DI and a speaker cabinet will be pretty different.

davve

[cassembler]

[the following applies only if you're using a compressor on bass as a way to control dynamics, instead of trying to create a cool compressed sound, which, as Dave so eloquently pointed out, is a painfully broad question.

I dunno, I usually go with longer release times for low frequencies. A 50 Hz sine wave has a period of 20 ms (if my math is correct), and if the release is faster than that, you'll end up with the compressor modulating the signal (think ring modulating).

In that light, I'd say that a release of at LEAST 80 ms to start, my gut tells me 150-300 is a good ballpark.

Attack would be one or two cycles- perhaps start at 20 ms. Of course, following up with a good limiter will be the only way to guarantee against overs.

But that's just $.02, you should always start fresh and adjust to necessity.

BTW, the threshold would be directly dependant on the incomming signal level, but I'd shoot for 3-9 dB under the incomming peaks, and ratio would be related to how bad you need to tame the signal.

[tiger vomitt]

in addition to what others have said here, i would offer this...

the way you set the compressor will have different effects on the bass, both obvious and subtle.

you can set the bass comp (and eq too) to leave the bass really really flat, where there arent any dynamics to speak of. this is awful in some situations and the best thing ever in other situations. but my point is that setting it that way will give a particular sound to your whole mix. the low end could have this thick sound that you might find enjoyable.

you can also set it so that the bass is very compressed but the attack and release knobs are acting on the signal to give you this (hopefully) cool bouncy thing. this will also have an effect on your mix as a whole.

what im getting at is, in a lot of mixes the bass guitar is taking up 50-99% of the low end of your song. compressing that one instrument is a move towards defining how the whole low end will sound in your song. ya dig?

[Fletcher]

FWIW... when I'm confronted with a bass sound that needs some "front end" to it I'll go with a slow attack and a quick to medium release... when I'm confronted with a bass sound that needs more of the "note" to be sucked out of it I'll go with a medium to long release.

When the players tone is OK but their playing requires some 'leveling' I'll go with a higher ratio with a pretty fast attack and release.

As has been explained... experimentation is the key, and good hardware is the lock. There are a plethora of compressors on the market that can't handle a bass tone worth a shit and will actually do more harm than good no matter how you set them up.

Again... FWIW (which ain't much) most of the time I'll use a Purple Audio MC-77 on bass or an Alactronics modified 1176. Best of luck with it.

[Dyno]

Fletcher,

What is a Alactronics modified 1176? I have the UA 1176 reissue and I really use the heck out of it, especially on bass and vocals.

Dyno

[soundguy]

sounds like an 1176 modified by alcatronics...

I'll second andrew roberts as the second coming of the 1176, Ive been using an MC76 for two years solid right now and out of every piece of gear I own, nothing gets used more than that box, and I mean nothing close. I was thinking about getting a reissue, but might just get a mc77.

dave

[drew w]

on the subject of bass compression and primers...

for an 8 track home studio situation...my bass player uses a tube compressor in the post eq effects loop on her amp.

where else in the chain is bass compression typically used for recording? while tracking or after the fact? if you have 2 bass tracks for example...say di and mic...are there "better" ways to use compression? on the mic'd track or the di track? (aside from the usual experiment and listen advice) I'm just trying to get some reference points for good recording techniques.

I also have a submixer...any advice on setting up a good mic/di/compressor scenario and sending/printing a single premixed track to the 8 track? any problems or potential pitfalls there?

thanks...

[j.hall]

if you want to get the low end huge you have to start with a medium slow attack

and the fastest possible release you can get away with

i'll crush the bass git with 15db of gain reduction

put the attack at it's fastest time, the comp will typically distort, then you back off the release until it cleans up and sounds right

then EQ the piss out of it (if required)

a distressor set to "nuke" is a good one as well

[Dyno]

Thats right... If you want the punch, slow attack and very fast release time. I use about -5 gain reduction on the amp and I run the DI thru an Avalon 737sp with light compression. I don't squish the DI channel too hard in case I need to re amp it later.

Dyno