Does this sound strange to you guys? (signal problem)

[honkyjonk]

Well I'm testing out my new old Tascam 48,
and I can't seem to get enought signal to the machine. The meters won't move more than an few hairs (unless I put my mouth right on the mic and scream) and I'm not hearing enought volume coming through the outs to the board.
My setup was
Sennheiser 421 to Universal Audio 2108 pre (cranked all the way up to 65, and the output all the way up) to the Tascam. I'm recording acoustic guitar with the mic about two feet from the guitar, playing around the same volume as most John Fahey tunes (if that's a good reference)
With the pre all the way up to 65dB and the output all the way up, shouldn't the needles be buried into the red? or at least close to the red?
I'm using the xlr ins and outs on the tascam, and they're +4dB. In the past I've only used a Tascam TSR-8 which has -10dB ins and outs, so it makes sense that reels recorded on the TSR 8 should play back on the 48 with more volume than what I'm recording right now and they do but the difference is huge.
I didn't estimate that I'd need more than 65dB of pre if using a dynamic on acoustic instruments when going through all balanced gear. Makes me wonder if I could even hear a ribbon. Anybody have any suggestions here?
There must be something wrong. I almost hope there is.
The other thing I thought of was maybe the xlr's are wired pin 3 hot, so I tried out a cable that was wired accordingly. I couldn't hear anything.
I also swapped out the mic, pre, and cables to see if they were the problem. They aren't. They all work on my cassette four track just fine. I'm wondering if that's just cause if has unbalanced ins though.
Anybody know whether the 48 is wired pin 2 or pin 3 hot?
Anybody think of anything here? I'm lost. I can't find the problem in the manual either.

[cassembler]

Just don't sound right to me...

[joeysimms]

I'm assuming you've cleaned the heads and tape path thoroughly?

When I bought my 48, the channels were low until they were cleaned 2 or 3 times.

[cassembler]

BTW, have you monitored what's comming out of the preamp?

[thunderboy]

Well, even if it WERE pin 3 hot, you'd still be getting signal - just reversed polarity. Have you tried swapping out the 2108 - [shudder]maybe there's a problem with your pre.[/shudder]

good luck!

jt

[xonlocust]

IF you've ruled out the pre (and monitored a decent level output) perhaps the 48 needs to be calibrated - and the record input trims are screwed up. do you have the same problem with line level signals? (ie is the problem in the tape machine or pre - and if in tape machine, is it the case for all tracks, or just some?)

[honkyjonk]

Nope it's not the preamp. I'd tried swapping it, same thing. I'm almost positive it's the 48. All the channels are the same. I've cleaned it too, maybe not enough, I don't know. I'm thinking that if it wasn't calibrated right, wouldn't it sound like the right amount of signal coming, just that the meters wouldn't say so? In this case it's both.
The line level coming out of the machine and going into my board seems to be fine because I tried an old reel made on the unbalanced TSR-8 and it sounded great.
Hmmmm. . . .

[honkyjonk]

xonlocust,
do you mean the pre in the Tascam, like the ones Otaris have? Cause the 48 only has line level ins and outs. What's peculiar about this machine though, is it has both xlr's and RCA's. I've tried the RCA's too, same thing.

[joeysimms]

If have you tried recording / playing back both in sync and playback mode? If a pre-recorded tape is playing back, then maybe there's something going on with rec function.

[xonlocust]

do you mean the pre in the Tascam, like the ones Otaris have?

no, i was referring to your external pre. the otaris likewise are only line level. read on...

If have you tried recording / playing back both in sync and playback mode? If a pre-recorded tape is playing back, then maybe there's something going on with rec function.

that's what i'm thinking. you said your tsr8 tape played back fine (although hotter than you expected) when you open up the machine, there is (or there should be, i've never opened a 48) a trim for the line level in. this is tied to calibrating the deck. there are different parts of calibrating the machine - adjusting the meters is part of it, but adjusting the record trim is another. it's not a mic pre - but a small trim that adjusts the line in line amp settings.

so, has this machine ever made a good (or proper rather) recording in your presence? could be something just got jostled in shipping or something. moreover - where'd you get it? are you sure you didnt get a dud? does the seller have any info on it? was it recently in commision?

so also, a qucik test you can do - send it a tone at 0 and see what happens. look at the calibration section in the manual and try to find something labeled rec trim or something like that.

also - oh, wait a minute... isnt the tsr8 an 8 track and 48 a 4 track?

[honkyjonk]

Yes, I've been looking through the manual some more and adjusting the line level seems like it would be something to try. I'll open it up tomarrow.
It might have been jostled during shipping, but all in all this deck from what i can tell cosmetically and looking and touching the heads, and how the transport is running, it is actually in better condition than i had anticipated. Thanks for all the help everybody. It's much appreciated.
Jon

[fireproof]

Hey
I have a 58 and even moving it 5 feet I can lose signal on some tracks.
The Audio cards dont sit that firmly.
carefully push on all the cards and make sure they are in there and making contact..you may have to pull them out to get some leverage on them and push them back in slowly...
If that does not do it I would have a tech check the circuit boards related to input and all connections going to the record head. You may have lost some connections in shipping.
adam

[joeysimms]

I have a 58 and even moving it 5 feet I can lose signal on some tracks. The Audio cards dont sit that firmly.

I haven't had that problem with my 48. It's been moved in the trunk of my car 3 or 4 times with no problem. In fact, when I was having a problem on one of my channels +4 input, I couldn't even pry the offending card loose, let alone reseat it. Turns out the problem was at the xlr connect, not the card.

It's starting to sound like the rec bias is way off. Take it to someone for an alignment and bias and see what happens.