any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

general questions, comments and ideas about recording, audio, music, etc.
ampguy
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any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by ampguy » Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:06 am

i'm planning on releasing my music on dvd-a, stereo, not surround, no fancy graphics or menus (maybe even using discwelder bronze).

any other folks doing something similar?

I've been listening to dvd-a and sacd for a couple of years, and can really hear and feel the difference over cds, even with modeset playback gear.

thanks for any tips, or links,

interesting data on dvd-a sales:

http://www.highfidelityreview.com/news/ ... r=18483611

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by Tim Casey » Tue Apr 27, 2004 2:23 am

The only thing I've been able to do is to create Dolby Digital files using AC-3 from DVD Studio Pro. If I stick 'em with a menu, I can at least hear my surround sound mixes away from my studio.

What kind of software do you have that will create DVD-A's?

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by Cellotron » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:20 am

Tim Casey wrote: What kind of software do you have that will create DVD-A's?
The high end options are from Sonic Studio & SADIE and are mega expensive - but Minnetonka has issued Discwelder which comes in 3 versions that are priced for every budget. Their mid line "Steel" version runs at $500 and has pretty much everything you'll need. They also have a "Bronze" version that will get you going with basic DVD-A authoring for only $100 - http://www.discwelder.com

Consumer interest in DVD-A unfortunately has been pretty darn low - I really thing the format, along with SACD, is going to die out or remain an audiophile nitch product only. DVD-V sales are the only optical discs that are showing growth though.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by ampguy » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:45 am

doubling of DVD-A sales in 2003 is not growth??
Cellotron wrote:
Tim Casey wrote: What kind of software do you have that will create DVD-A's?
The high end options are from Sonic Studio & SADIE and are mega expensive - but Minnetonka has issued Discwelder which comes in 3 versions that are priced for every budget. Their mid line "Steel" version runs at $500 and has pretty much everything you'll need. They also have a "Bronze" version that will get you going with basic DVD-A authoring for only $100 - http://www.discwelder.com

Consumer interest in DVD-A unfortunately has been pretty darn low - I really thing the format, along with SACD, is going to die out or remain an audiophile nitch product only. DVD-V sales are the only optical discs that are showing growth though.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by Cellotron » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:58 am

ampguy wrote:doubling of DVD-A sales in 2003 is not growth??
You're talking of going from a 1.3% market share to a 2.7% market share - with a lot of the folks involved in the optical manufacturing biz (that is - who aren't part of the DVDForum) not predicting a further "boom"

When you're going from almost nothing - nearly anything is "growth."

I'm not knocking the format at all - I think it's great - but compare sales figures of DVD-A with portable mp3 players and I think you'll see where the consumer trend really is going.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by ampguy » Tue Apr 27, 2004 7:08 am

sure, mp3 players, as well as shavers, are going to outsell dvd-a discs.

but if we look at say retail cd sales, and dvd-a, dvd-a is growing faster than cds.

why would I want to buy a $13 CD for 16/44 quality, when I can pay $3 more, and get the same music in 24/192?

A lot of folks like me, don't buy cds anymore, but we do buy DVD-As.
Cellotron wrote:
ampguy wrote:doubling of DVD-A sales in 2003 is not growth??
You're talking of going from a 1.3% market share to a 2.7% market share - with a lot of the folks involved in the optical manufacturing biz (that is - who aren't part of the DVDForum) not predicting a further "boom"

When you're going from almost nothing - nearly anything is "growth."

I'm not knocking the format at all - I think it's great - but compare sales figures of DVD-A with portable mp3 players and I think you'll see where the consumer trend really is going.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by Cellotron » Tue Apr 27, 2004 7:27 am

ampguy wrote:sure, mp3 players, as well as shavers, are going to outsell dvd-a discs.

but if we look at say retail cd sales, and dvd-a, dvd-a is growing faster than cds.
That's an easy thing to do because retail CD sales are in very serious decline.
why would I want to buy a $13 CD for 16/44 quality, when I can pay $3 more, and get the same music in 24/192?
That makes sense to me also. I think it's important to note though that the majority of inexpensive consumer DVD-V players that also have DVD-A compatibility have DA converters that are really only working at 48kHz!
A lot of folks like me, don't buy cds anymore, but we do buy DVD-As.
This doesn't change my belief that DVD-A will not be the future standard for delivery of consumer audio. Ampguy - don't get me wrong - I like hi-res audio as much as you and think DVD-A is a fantastic way to get this - but as audio pro's we need to base our decisioning on what to invest for future upgrades on a clear and realistic evaluation of the consumer market if we hope to see our investments reward us. And based on markets and trends (including the fact that petroleum costs because of politics and more importantly global depletion rates are going to sky rocket in the next few years making polycarbonate for optical discs, energy costs in manufacturing and shipping costs (i.e. pricy diesel) also get more expensive - meaning digital delivery will be even more economically attractive) I simply think a lo-fi format will end up on top.

Best regards,
Steve Berson

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by chris harris » Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:30 am

Wavelab 5 will have authoring for dvd-a.

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by kcrusher » Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:40 am

Cellotron wrote:
That's an easy thing to do because retail CD sales are in very serious decline.
Dunno where you're getting your info, but Soundscan is reporting something completely different.

--For the first quarter of 2003 Soundscan registered 147,000,000 records sold.
--For the 1st quarter of 2004 Soundscan will report 160,000,000 records sold.
That's 13,000,000 more units, almost a 10% increase in sales since last
year.

(and those numbers are based on units SOLD, not shipped or any other method of music industry/RIAA skewing to show lower 'sales' to prop up their arguement that downloads are hurting cd sales)
Cellotron wrote: This doesn't change my belief that DVD-A will not be the future standard for delivery of consumer audio. Ampguy - don't get me wrong - I like hi-res audio as much as you and think DVD-A is a fantastic way to get this - but as audio pro's we need to base our decisioning on what to invest for future upgrades on a clear and realistic evaluation of the consumer market if we hope to see our investments reward us. And based on markets and trends (including the fact that petroleum costs because of politics and more importantly global depletion rates are going to sky rocket in the next few years making polycarbonate for optical discs, energy costs in manufacturing and shipping costs (i.e. pricy diesel) also get more expensive - meaning digital delivery will be even more economically attractive) I simply think a lo-fi format will end up on top.
You should check out this link on the new Sony Blu-Ray paper DVD's:

http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/News/Press ... /04-0415E/

I, too, think that DVD-A/SACD will be esoteric for awhile to come, but you'll probably start seeing more of it as time goes by and people realize the benefits of surround. You'll probably also start seeing more DVD releases with audio and videos on the same cd and additional content to entice people to purchase those releases.
America... just a nation of two hundred million used car salesmen with all the money we need to buy guns and no qualms about killing anybody else in the world who tries to make us uncomfortable.
- Hunter S. Thompson

ampguy
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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by ampguy » Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:21 pm

hmm, have they announced any details or pricing?

the minnetonka levels are like this:

bronze $99 lets you make a DVD-A with stereo up to 24/192, but no graphics or menus, and surrounds limited to 24/48 (no MLP support)

middle $999 one lets you do the same as above, with some minimal graphics, but surrounds still limited to 24/48

top of the line $2500 lets you do all of the above, plus surrounds 24/96 or whatever, supports MLP

so bronze is actually OK for folks like me who sometimes don't even turn on the tv, just hit play a few times on the dvd-a player.

but the top of the line would be min. for someone wanting to author a commercial dvd-a release.

actually, as dvd-a has taken off in asia with audiophiles, e.g. dvd-a car units, etc., maybe the graphics-less dvd-a stereo will take off. the graphics on the commercial dvd-a's are pretty lame, fun to watch once, that's about it.




subatomic pieces wrote:Wavelab 5 will have authoring for dvd-a.

MAR
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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by MAR » Tue Apr 27, 2004 1:48 pm

Great, just we need. A way to listen to you play poorly in a higher quality audio format.

The part I love is
i'm planning on releasing my music
. Your music? Are you talking about the stuff you've posted clips of? If it is, I know what I want for christmas. Where are you releasing it? Is there a big market for guys who sound like they're playing the guitar with boxing gloves on?

Those clips regardless of your lack of technique, suffer from melody-lessness. That's not music, that's noodling...badly. Where are the melodies?

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by ampguy » Tue Apr 27, 2004 3:53 pm

excellent timing!!

Mar,
I was just thinking of you as I created this awesome blues piece!!

http://www.demoyourtrax.com/~purpletele ... a575e3.mp3

MAR
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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by MAR » Tue Apr 27, 2004 5:23 pm

ampguy,

Contrary to what you and some of the others might think, I'm not here just to bust on you.

With your latest offering, your
awesome blues piece
, I am perplexed. Are you pulling my leg or are you completely sincere. Because that sounds like a gag to me. So if you are indeed kidding me and you have a dry sense of humor that I'm missing, OK i missed the joke. But if you are being honest then WOW, you are worse than ever. You have no feel for the blues at all. Your playing is almost robotic, and that's being cruel to robots. A robot has more soul than you have. Your playing is more like a robot programmed to be the quintessential, stereotypical, cliched worst guitar player on earth.

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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by contrabanman » Tue Apr 27, 2004 5:34 pm

i'm planning on releasing my music on dvd-a
:shock:

Ampguy,
seriously? I think you may be picking up some good directional criticism here. I listened to your clips too, and I'm sorry - but I'm having trouble taking you seriously on any subject related to music production. You might think about saving a little face, and take a few lessons, and practice alot before you attempt to release ANYTHING! Making these tunes is a good way to get feedback, and hear what you're doing wrong vs. right. But I gotta tell you, there is no structure to your music, no rhythm in your playing, and it doesn't even sound like you are listening to the drum sample you are playing to! The Drums are there to keep the beat man!!!!!!!!!!!

Now the good news: You discovered the blues box! Cool! Now, mess with it for a few months every single day - Learn the major scale, and the church modes, Record a 12 bar progression, and jam over it. That way you'll hear what you can and can't do, and learn new licks. Oh Ya, practice to a LOUD Drum beat, so you don't drown it out with your "funk" - Dig?

As for format of your "upcoming release": Cross that bridge when you have something to release!

Contra

MAR
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Re: any budget dvd-a studio folks here?

Post by MAR » Tue Apr 27, 2004 5:36 pm

Thank You

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