Best 2 track tape deck for cheap???

[cassembler]

I'm looking for a 2 track (probably 1/2") that's cheap, basic, and small. Don't need a lot of frills (not that there really are any), and preferably new.

Money is an object; I have none, so any I save for it is more than I'd like to spend, but I'm thinking $500 tops if possible, preferably something closer to half that, which I know is quite limiting.

I obviously want to use this for an alternative "sound processing" for mastering, and I'm already aware of basic maintenance, just need to get back into practice...

Any thoughts? Experiences with good decks, bad decks?

Would taking a 4 track cassette and using it as a two track (1/8" per track) be worth considering, if I used pre/post EQ and compression as a noise reduction?

[markpar]

Are there any 1/2" 2-track decks to be had for that price range? My 1/4" Otari MTR-10 was $700, used.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your question. Do you mean reel-to-reel 1/2" 2 track deck? If so, you'll pay at least 2k for one, unfortunately. And they're all used.

-mark

[soundguy]

I mix to 1/4" 2 track and its a bombastic format. I have never not even half a time felt the need to upgrade to a 1/2" machine. My results combined with the cost of 1/2" stock really have never caused me to think twice about that one. I've got an ampex 440b which is all discrete and the most aggressive sounding tape mahcine I have ever heard. You can grab em up between $500 and $1k. Studer B67's are really cool, much smoother sounding than a 440 any day of the week. They are around the same price. I've also heard MCI's and they've got that disco vibe, and are probably the cheapest of the bunch. Ive got a scully 280 which is sort of half running, its an interesting souding deck, but it never worked as a mixdown deck for me, real soft sounding. Horrible transport too.

Unless you are getting clientelle bringing 1/2" tapes in for you to work from, I would totally try to find the right 1/4" deck. Its more cost effective with stock, people will be less hesistant to mix on it because of that, plus you'll be hard pressed to find someone who really DOES NOT dig it because the format is too narrow. 1/4" rules for rock.

dave

[markpar]

Dave,

What tape do you mix to? I've been using 456 and bought some GP9 to try out. I'm calibrated +3/250nWm.

-mark

[soundguy]

mark-

GP9 at 355nW/m. rules.

dave

[markpar]

GP9 at 355nW/m. rules.

I'll try that!

Dang, that means a new MRL, right?

-mark

[soundguy]

nope. If your tape is 255 and you are aligning +3 over, thats 355.

I've found that at around +5 the tape starts to saturate, so at +6 its going to be consistently compressing your transients. Quantegy reccomends running the stock at +9, but I dont see the need really. Sounds amazing at +6.

dave

[markpar]

Sweet!! Thanks for the clarification, Dave!

-mark

[moogplayer]

I can't think of any * small * 1/2" 2-track decks. Most have big footprints. But don't underestimate 1/4" 2-track. Studer B67, Otari MX5050 mkIII, Tascam 42/52. Hell, I mix to an ancient 1976 Teac 25-2 @ 15ips and it beefs up my ADAT recordings...

[NewYorkDave]

You must have meant 1/4"... If you want small, cheap and basic, consider the Tascam 22-2. It's probably the smallest, cheapest half-track, 15 IPS machine around, and it does an all right job. I've got two of 'em. The I/O is unbalanced, -8dBu, but there are ways to deal with that.

[cassembler]

Ok, so 1/4"...

1) Nobody makes these new any more?
2) What kind of price range is tape stock?
3) Is callibration otherwise the same as 2" (ie, tone tape, biasing, etc) just 22 fewer tracks? Anybody have a good resource for this?

Basically, I'm looking for a great mixdown deck, balanced I/O, small, cheap, to intarfact with a sound card.

So Dave, you're saying an Ampex 440b is a great bet, as well as a Studer B67's and MCI's... What about Otari or Tascam?

[matthewbarnhart]

Hey, you're in the DFW area, right? PM me, and I can point you in the direction of a fellow with a few MTR-10's and some MCI 1/4" machines for sale, all in reasonably good shape. I bought our MTR-10 and MTR-90 from him, and have been quite happy.

Ok, so 1/4"...
1) Nobody makes these new any more?

Yeah, but for the money you'll pay, you could get a used 1/4" ATR-102 and be much happier.

2) What kind of price range is tape stock?

I pay about $23/reel for EMTEC 900, and around the same for Quantegy GP9. (The one record I mixed on GP9 sounded fantastic; haven't used it since, though.) 911 and 456 are a little less, and I get it all from WM Sales in Duncanville.

I run at 15ips/CCIR with EMTEC 900, and it's basically noiseless and sounds great to me.

3) Is callibration otherwise the same as 2" (ie, tone tape, biasing, etc) just 22 fewer tracks? Anybody have a good resource for this?

Exactly the same. What kind of resource do you need?

Basically, I'm looking for a great mixdown deck, balanced I/O, small, cheap, to intarfact with a sound card.

I like my MTR-10 -- it was cheap, sounds good, does NAB, CCIR, and AES, 7.5, 15, and 30 ips, and is reliable. I haven't mixed down to anything else since I purchased it. In fact, I haven't touched a computer for audio work in the last six months, except for mastering and making rough mixes. I do all 2" 16-track, mixed to 1/4" stereo, editing and sequencing the master reels before they go out for mastering.

mb

[soundguy]

nobody makes them anymore.

tape is affordable, you're looking at 10" reels on a pro deck or 7" reels on a tascam 22.

the electronics on some units, like a 440 for example, are the same as on the multitracks, so in most cases, calibration is exactly the same as if you were doing a 24 track, but with 22 less tracks.

I love my 440b, but like any tape deck, it needs to let you know who is boss every once in a while. If you can hear these machines at local studios, I'd reccomend it, they all have a different sound for sure, you might like one way more than another. And DO NOT buy a tape machine from ebay, you want to make sure you can inspect the deck and run it a bit, there is a lot that can go wrong, but generally, its somewhat easy to fix when it does. I also have a tascam 22 and it has that tascam sound and its a cool deck. Its unbalanced, but on a budget, its very cool. also check out the revox decks which would be the step up from there.

the one thing a 440b, b67, scully 280, mci, etc, is not is small. these things have a footprint for sure. The tascam 22 however, you can keep on a shelf, its a nice little machine that doesnt sound so bad. A 440 has a 20 times the depth however. discrete electronics go a long way.

dave

[eflatminor]

I got an idea for you. For 500 bucks or under, you might find a two track 1/4" reel to reel recorder like the UHER 4200 Report Monitor. Although it's designed for field recording, it's perfectly capable in the studio. Think news reporter circa 1965 with the recorder strapped over his shoulder. The best recorder of this type is the Nagra IV but you wouldn't find one in your price range.

I don't know how the sound of the UHER would compare to a normal studio deck but if nothing else, I bet it would be unique.

[markpar]

What about Otari or Tascam?

I've got an Otari MTR-10 and love it.

The calibration process is pretty much the same as a 24-track. Just, like you said, 22 less tracks.

-mark