where should we place this?

[whatchamachicken]

We are in the process of selling our old console and have purchased a new one. We are thinking of changing our setup a bit as far as where we place everything. Our room is roughly 19' by 12', but not quite an exact rectangle. The north and west walls are drywall and the south and east are brick. There is a door on the west wall on the north end. I am trying to figure out the optimum placement for the console and also what and where to put acoustic treatment on the walls (cheaply). I think the console is roughly 5' or 6' wide. Hopefully this isn't all too confusing to you all. I have a diagram I made on my computer but I'm not sure how to attatch stuff here so you can look at it. If anyone could explain it I can put up my diagram to clarify what I'm describing here. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

After re-reading this, I think I ccould simplify this a bit by saying, the way we have the room set up now is that we have the left and back wals brick and the right and fromt walls are drywall. We are currently running parrallel to the long walls. Is it better to be facing the long or short lengths of the room? Our console right now is too big to put on the short wall but the new one will be much shorter and we can place it pretty much anywhere.

[squizo]

your room sounds like its pretty close to mine....except i have one brick wall ....my first suggestion would be to try to keep the brick wall in front of you and behind you....try to center the console while leaving room to walk sit and shit.....as far as soundproofing goes i bought some MOPAD auralex monitors isolation pads and they work great for decoupling the monitors....i also bought 2 Roominator kits which are just 1'x1' squares (30 per kit) ...figure out where you are gonna be sitting roughly for mixing etc. and have a friend move a small mirror along the side, front, and back walls...where you see your monitors in the mirror put the squares....i just used 4 of them put together in a cube (2 on top ,2 on bottom) and turned it 90 degrees so it looks like a diamond...maybe build a 7'x7' block with the tiles at your back in the center of the brick wall??? ...just doing the soundproofing improved my mixing and translation greatly and all that for only $250....fuck an acoustic engineer, you don't need one

good luck

[Ethan Winer]

Chicken,

> I am trying to figure out the optimum placement for the console and also what and where to put acoustic treatment on the walls (cheaply). <

The goal is to have the left and right sides symmetrical to obtain good stereo imaging. You also want the loudspeakers to face the long way into the room. Another goal in a room that size is to be seated about 38 percent of the way back from the front wall. So center your mix position between the left and right walls, with the seat 7.2 feet back from the front wall. Then place the speakers 7.2 feet apart, flat against the front wall, and also centered between the left and right sides.

As for acoustic treatment, rooms that size need low frequency absorption more than anything else. Thin foam panels will reduce overall ambience and echoes, but they do nothing for low frequencies. For that you need real bass traps, and real bass traps do not have to be expensive.

--Ethan

[aurelialuz]

so if i have a room about this size and one short side is a wall, and the other short side has an opening into another room, it is better to have that opening behind you, in front of you or closed off?

alex

[whatchamachicken]

Ethan,
Thanks for your advice. I checked out the real traps websight. What do you think I will need for bass traps? Nunber, size, placement, etc.? I am thinking of putting some Auralex on the side and front walls. Would a couple of those mini realtraps put in the back corners be good enough? The door is in one of those corners though. Does that affect anything?

[rhythm ranch]

...place the speakers 7.2 feet apart, flat against the front wall, and also centered between the left and right sides.

--Ethan

Hi Ethan,
Could you talk some more about this. Many manufacturers recommend not placing monitors against the wall because of the increased bass response.
Thanks,
Mark

[Ethan Winer]

Alex,

> the other short side has an opening into another room, it is better to have that opening behind you, in front of you or closed off? <

It's hard to say without being there. But I'll assume closed off because that's the most symmetrical. Behind you is the second best choice.

--Ethan

[aurelialuz]

It's hard to say without being there. But I'll assume closed off because that's the most symmetrical. Behind you is the second best choice.

thanks ethan.

alex

[Ethan Winer]

Whatchama,

> What do you think I will need for bass traps? Number, size, placement, etc.? <

For most rooms, including rooms the size of yours, we recommend eight MiniTraps all placed in corners, and all spread around the room as evenly as possible. You can see a drawing and read a few short paragraphs on the Placing MiniTraps page of our site www.realtraps.com. But feel free to ask further questions if your room is different enough to need custom advice.

> I am thinking of putting some Auralex on the side and front walls. Would a couple of those mini realtraps put in the back corners be good enough? The door is in one of those corners though. Does that affect anything? <

If it's thick enough, foam is okay for placing on the walls to stop early reflections. The real issue is how low in frequency the absorption extends to. All acoustic absorber materials absorb 100 percent at high frequencies, but thicker and denser materials extend the absorption lower. This is one reason we recently came out with MicroTraps. They're much better at low frequencies than most foam panels, but less expensive than MiniTraps.

Normally we recommend mounting MiniTraps straddling a corner, since that's where they absorb the lowest frequencies. When this is not possible you can get similar performance by mounting two MiniTraps on the walls as close as you can get them to the corner. If you space the MiniTraps away from the wall a little they absorb to an even lower frequency. So for rooms that have a door right in the corner, you could put one MiniTrap on the door and another on the adjacent wall.

Two MiniTraps might be enough to hear some improvement, but four is a more practical minimum. Though you really need eight to do a complete job in that room. It's simply a matter of covering enough of the room's surfaces so they absorb rather than reflect.

--Ethan

[Ethan Winer]

Mark,

> Could you talk some more about this. Many manufacturers recommend not placing monitors against the wall because of the increased bass response. <

Glad to.

Yes, when you place loudspeakers near a wall the bass response increases somewhat. The "EQ curve" that results is a shelving boost. This is easy to correct for with the bass rolloff built into many active monitors. And for speakers with no such correction it's still easy enough to compensate for either with a simple EQ or just by ear.

When a loudspeaker is mounted away from the wall the response is badly skewed with a series of peaks and dips - comb filtering - and this is all but impossible to correct using either EQ or by trying to "learn the room." So to me its clear than an overall increase in bass level is far less damaging than a series of many peaks and dips that extend into the upper bass range.

Also, in case you're wondering, the cause of the comb filtering is the time delay between low frequencies that leave the front of the speaker and combine with the low frequencies that all speakers radiate omnidirectionally. That is, waves from the front of the speaker go directly to your ears, while waves from the rear have to first bounce off the wall.

--Ethan

[tiger vomitt]

so if i have a room about this size and one short side is a wall, and the other short side has an opening into another room, it is better to have that opening behind you, in front of you or closed off?

alex

that is an awesome question. it describes my room perfectly and i couldnt figure out how to phrase it in under 10000 words

i put a shelving unit there that covers half the open space and filled it up with books and other mildly absorbing materials. it's not a perfect solution and it's probably not even permanent, but it at least cut down on the reverb coming in from the other room.

[Flight Feathers]

so if i have a room about this size and one short side is a wall, and the other short side has an opening into another room, it is better to have that opening behind you, in front of you or closed off?

alex

that is an awesome question. it describes my room perfectly and i couldnt figure out how to phrase it in under 10000 words

i put a shelving unit there that covers half the open space and filled it up with books and other mildly absorbing materials. it's not a perfect solution and it's probably not even permanent, but it at least cut down on the reverb coming in from the other room.

i nailed a heavy blanket to the opening. it helps a lot. when i don't need it there i tie it up.

ayan