Att'n: Brooklyn & NYC area Tape Oppers - job needed

Regional activities, relevant news, job openings, studio searches, local beer nights (not a forum to plug the new album you just worked on)

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Zeppelin4Life
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Post by Zeppelin4Life » Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:43 pm

Look, I have to step in here. I am 21 years old, and I find this post extremely not only weird and disturbing, but almost offensive...

I am among the youngest group in tapeop, I am a college student, taking out ridiculous loans to try to, hopefully, someday, make a living.honestly, without sounding like a jerk, good luck, because he is really going to need it. I am getting my bachelors in aviation technology at purdue university. After that I hope to continue to get my masters.. i currently bust my ASS off, have a 4.0 average GPA, am currently publishing a book, and I have been turned down from INTERNSHIPS!! We have people (grown men and women) with MASTERS DEGREES in management (MBAs) applying for $29k/year assistant line manager jobs. This is NOT the economy to try to get into recording, and CERTAINLY not the economy to have your mom or dad trying to help. Hell, most mom and dads are having a hard enough time finding jobs for THEMSELVES!!!

Do i love music? Sure, it is one of my passions. however, I am not an idiot, and going to such a techie school has taught me that it takes a lot more than jut 'talent' to make it. these people work. hard. really hard. Their parents cant take the tests for them,.

So, with that said, if i was an employer I would surely like to know.. What school did your son go to, what degrees does he have? What was his GPA? What types of activities has he done? Being talented is one thing, but most of the time, if you don't have a degree, you are going to be fucked. There is nothing else about it. If that's unfair, I can see that, but welcome to the 21st century. I am surrounded by Chineese and Indian kids who are a billion times smarter than any american kid ive ever met, and they will take our technical jobs.

I had to work my ass of in high school, take out a huge student loan (which I am still doing) and try to get as many scholarships as possible. It's not easy. Let him do it. If your son is a normal kid like I suspect, what you're doing is downright sickening.
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Post by chris harris » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:31 pm

Zeppelin4Life wrote:So, with that said, if i was an employer I would surely like to know.. What school did your son go to, what degrees does he have? What was his GPA? What types of activities has he done? Being talented is one thing, but most of the time, if you don't have a degree, you are going to be fucked. There is nothing else about it. If that's unfair, I can see that, but welcome to the 21st century.
This is just nonsense as it pertains to the recording industry. If I owned a NYC studio and was looking for help, I can assure you that I wouldn't give a shit what school an applicant went to, whether or not they have a degree, what their fucking GPA was, or whether or not they were in Phi Beta Whatthefuckever.

If I'm a NYC studio owner, chances are, I've already got a list a mile long of people who have SOME experience, who would be willing to bust their ass to work for me. If I'm looking to actually hire someone, all I'd want to know are the following things:

1. Are they dependable?
2. Will they BRING the studio any business?
3. Are they handy with a soldering iron?
4. Do they have some examples of good recording work that they've done?
5. Do they have any references from other studios and/or clients who I know?

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Post by chris harris » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:38 pm

Also, to everyone:

The guy is trying to help his son find a job. He's mentioning it on a forum where lots of people in the field that his son wants to work hang out. It's comical how some of you are trying to psychoanalyze his relationship with his son. Back the fuck off.

TOMB is like the bar where audio people hang out. If I was a mechanic, and I hung out at a bar where other mechanics hang out, and my son wanted to be a mechanic, it wouldn't be a big deal at all for me to mention to other mechanics that my son is looking for work. Of course, I'd probably TAKE MY SON TO THAT BAR and introduce him around, if that's what he really wanted to do.

Tell your son to register here and start working actively on the whole "networking" thing. Then, just ignore all of these people. What you're doing is not outlandish. For someone to assume you're coddling him, just based on what you've posted is stupid. But, DO introduce him to the TOMB. If he really wants to do this, the sooner he starts networking with others who do it, the better.

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Post by Zeppelin4Life » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:04 pm

subatomic pieces wrote:
Zeppelin4Life wrote:So, with that said, if i was an employer I would surely like to know.. What school did your son go to, what degrees does he have? What was his GPA? What types of activities has he done? Being talented is one thing, but most of the time, if you don't have a degree, you are going to be fucked. There is nothing else about it. If that's unfair, I can see that, but welcome to the 21st century.
This is just nonsense as it pertains to the recording industry. If I owned a NYC studio and was looking for help, I can assure you that I wouldn't give a shit what school an applicant went to, whether or not they have a degree, what their fucking GPA was, or whether or not they were in Phi Beta Whatthefuckever.

If I'm a NYC studio owner, chances are, I've already got a list a mile long of people who have SOME experience, who would be willing to bust their ass to work for me. If I'm looking to actually hire someone, all I'd want to know are the following things:

1. Are they dependable?
2. Will they BRING the studio any business?
3. Are they handy with a soldering iron?
4. Do they have some examples of good recording work that they've done?
5. Do they have any references from other studios and/or clients who I know?
How much do you honestly expect to pay someone who can only 'record'? Honestly. And having said that, then why are there so many 'recording engineering' college programs? Are you saying they are BS?

Let the kid go to school, and get a decent job, THEN let him go into recording. At least, that's just my opinion. It took me a LONG time to apply for jobs and internships, and I finally landed a very solid one for this summer at $40/hour. Granted it has nothing to do with music or recording (aviation), but at 21 years old, that's not that shabby. I am very happy to do what i do.

Everyone has their own goals, but never underestimate the power of education, ever.
?I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.?
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Post by chris harris » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:28 pm

Zeppelin4Life wrote:How much do you honestly expect to pay someone who can only 'record'? Honestly.
I don't even know what that means! "only 'record'"... what does that mean? and, where do you get the idea that if I own a studio in NYC, that I'd be looking for someone who can "only record"?
Zeppelin4Life wrote:And having said that, then why are there so many 'recording engineering' college programs?
$$$$$$$ UTFSF. This has been covered over and over again on TOMB. Sure, there's value in educating yourself HOWEVER YOU CAN. And, getting an audio-related degree from an accredited university is smart, if only because that degree will still mean SOMETHING if you are forced to pursue a job outside of audio. Lots of good jobs simply require a college degree of any kind. But, as far as finding a job in the audio industry, that degree won't mean much. It certainly won't mean as much as the quality of the recordings on your demo reel.
Zeppelin4Life wrote:Are you saying they are BS?
No. I'm sure that there's plenty of useful information to be learned in programs like those. But, I am saying that they're ABSOLUTELY NOT NECESSARY. I bet that there are waaaaay more people making a living in audio who don't have a degree on their wall, than who do.
Zeppelin4Life wrote:Let the kid go to school, and get a decent job, THEN let him go into recording. At least, that's just my opinion. It took me a LONG time to apply for jobs and internships, and I finally landed a very solid one for this summer at $40/hour. Granted it has nothing to do with music or recording (aviation), but at 21 years old, that's not that shabby. I am very happy to do what i do.
Awesome! Good for you! Sounds like you're not actively pursuing a career in audio recording or engineering, though... Are you suggesting that the OP encourage his son to get an aviation degree??
Zeppelin4Life wrote:Everyone has their own goals, but never underestimate the power of education, ever.
Who's doing that??? I'm sure that if you wanna fly planes, or build/repair planes, then that degree is going to be very, very important in your quest for employment.

But, honestly, in the audio world, it's not that important at all. I'm not discounting the advantage of learning everything you can about recording. And, yeah.. maybe if you just aspire to be an employee of a studio or a tech at a studio, then the degree might help you get a foot in the door. But, if you want to be an audio engineer, and make recordings for a living, nobody is really gonna care if you have a degree. I've been recording (and making a reasonable living doing it) for 9 years now. I've never had a client ask what degree I hold, what my GPA was, or if I participated in any activities in college. I've also worked as a freelance engineer in a few other studios. And, none of the owners of those studios asked me those things either.

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Post by Brian » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:34 pm

subatomic pieces wrote:
Brian wrote:Either way, it' weird, and since you like Charles Manson's music, you are weird. That's all I'm saying.
You're a drama queen. A weirdo, and no one in their right mind would ever say they liked that murdering swine's music, screw how you feel, screw whatever you think you were doing, it isn't what you ended up doing and you outed yourself for being as weird as you are, tough luck. We're bad, my god, you like a mass murderer's music.
Get thee away from me asshole.
Come on, now... This is pretty fucking ridiculous. Does this mean that if you listen to Lennon or Marley, that you're a weirdo who condones beating on your women and adultery?!?!

As far as why it's not his son trying to make good connections and network (the most important thing in this industry), I'm with you. But, going off on the Manson photo is childish, ridiculous and short sighted. You may not listen to music created by a mass murderer. But, you undoubtedly listen to some music created by great artists who happen to be criminals or very bad people.

that part of this thread is childish and outrageously OT.
Chris, there quite a diff from beating, adultery and MASS MURDER!
It wasn't the photo, it was the admission of liking his music.
Some people are best to die in anonymity after their atrocities. Their music, if you can call it that is to be forgotten.

Don't assume to know what I listen to, although, in Memphis, it is a good bet that one would unknowingly listen to a felon. I still love you though.

I'm pretty sure I or anyone else wouldn't get far in the accompanying Charlie Manson concert and tour shirt or the tour jacket for his concerts either. It wasn't the pic, the pic had me ask the question and the answer turned up the heat.
Invite a date over and when she gets to your boudoise and sees the Manson poster on your wall, guess where she goes, running for her life. Paint his picture on the front of your house or put up signs and your property won't be worth spit send your kids to school in shirts with his pic on it and guess what, no friends.

Is it off topic, yes, but, is it unimportant, not if one of your relatives was one of his victims. So, I stick to my assertions and ad this: Fuck Charles Manson and anyone who thinks he's neato. It's not to be supported ever.

BTW, if I did go to a bar to hang out, and I met a cool dude who's son was into audio like his dad, I'd think that was cool, but, if he told me he liked C. manson's music, I wouldn't be employing or supporting either. I do not support that. I would scoot down a few chairs or leave, it could be the Manson liker's bar, I dunno.
Last edited by Brian on Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Harumph!

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Post by BlackTrees » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:37 pm

Zeppelin4Life wrote:Look, I have to step in here. I am 21 years old, and I find this post extremely not only weird and disturbing, but almost offensive...

I am among the youngest group in tapeop, I am a college student, taking out ridiculous loans to try to, hopefully, someday, make a living.honestly, without sounding like a jerk, good luck, because he is really going to need it. I am getting my bachelors in aviation technology at purdue university. After that I hope to continue to get my masters.. i currently bust my ASS off, have a 4.0 average GPA, am currently publishing a book, and I have been turned down from INTERNSHIPS!! We have people (grown men and women) with MASTERS DEGREES in management (MBAs) applying for $29k/year assistant line manager jobs. This is NOT the economy to try to get into recording, and CERTAINLY not the economy to have your mom or dad trying to help. Hell, most mom and dads are having a hard enough time finding jobs for THEMSELVES!!!

Do i love music? Sure, it is one of my passions. however, I am not an idiot, and going to such a techie school has taught me that it takes a lot more than jut 'talent' to make it. these people work. hard. really hard. Their parents cant take the tests for them,.

So, with that said, if i was an employer I would surely like to know.. What school did your son go to, what degrees does he have? What was his GPA? What types of activities has he done? Being talented is one thing, but most of the time, if you don't have a degree, you are going to be fucked. There is nothing else about it. If that's unfair, I can see that, but welcome to the 21st century. I am surrounded by Chineese and Indian kids who are a billion times smarter than any american kid ive ever met, and they will take our technical jobs.

I had to work my ass of in high school, take out a huge student loan (which I am still doing) and try to get as many scholarships as possible. It's not easy. Let him do it. If your son is a normal kid like I suspect, what you're doing is downright sickening.
I have been reading this forum for months, and I had to make an account when I saw this.

This is probably one of the most true, soulful, and actually REAL posts I have ever read on here. In fact, I almost had tears in my eyes. The entire work ethic of the young people in this country is down the shitter, and I just wanted to let you know it's really inspiring and reassuring when I know a young person actually understands it. You will go far, kid. Purdue is one of the best schools in the world. You will be the leaders of the next generation...keep it up, and best of luck to you.

BTW, purdue is gettin its ass kicked by uconn right now!!

Bryan

Zeppelin4Life
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Post by Zeppelin4Life » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:44 pm

BlackTrees wrote:
BTW, purdue is gettin its ass kicked by uconn right now!!
Indeed. The bars down the street are so fuckin loud, I swear my building is shaking! Hummel is a trooper tho aint he?
?I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.?
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BlackTrees
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Post by BlackTrees » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:53 pm

Zeppelin4Life wrote:
BlackTrees wrote:
BTW, purdue is gettin its ass kicked by uconn right now!!
Indeed. The bars down the street are so fuckin loud, I swear my building is shaking! Hummel is a trooper tho aint he?

Ahh! I wish I was back at school :( Well we've done enough ruining this thread. Take care! :twisted:

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Post by BENDYmusic » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:54 pm

This thread baffles me, and has ruined about 4 and a half minutes of my day. :shock: I don't understand all the hatred, judgmental comments, and mean remarks between members of our online community. Is this not a place where we can voice our thoughts and experiences without hurting each other? Is this thread some kind of inside joke? Who gives a fuck if OP guy is looking for work for himself, his son, or his pet rock? I just don't get all the nastiness. Disagree fine, but have some respect and integrity. Good luck friends..

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Post by rwc » Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:43 pm

I remember in early 2008 talking to Roy Hendrickson, he was talking about how NYU asked if he would speak to their recording students about finding work, etc. He never took it up to my knowledge. I said "the work out there is what you make for yourself"

he agreed, but at the time, I was a hypocrite. I didn't start following my own advice until just recently. I am glad that I did, I spent 2 years ignoring so many opportunities.
Real friends stab you in the front.

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Post by BlackTrees » Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:47 pm

rwc wrote:I remember in early 2008 talking to Roy Hendrickson, he was talking about how NYU asked if he would speak to their recording students about finding work, etc. He never took it up to my knowledge. I said "the work out there is what you make for yourself"

he agreed, but at the time, I was a hypocrite. I didn't start following my own advice until just recently. I am glad that I did, I spent 2 years ignoring so many opportunities.
The same is true with a lot of fields tho. I don't know many that just seem to fall into your lap!

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Post by Brian » Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:49 pm

I don't think anyone cares really, just, he put up a pst and you know that is asking for input, so he got some, honest input from people, and he didn't like it and got hostile, answered some questions in a hostile manner and got more input, then Chris swung in on a rope, tried to rescue him, I cut the rope and Zep threw down the gauntlet, made a dash for the line, won the race and we all went home.
What was this thread about?
Oh yeah, Dad trying to help kid get a job.
It's normally better than being disengaged as a family, but, the jury is still out.

Hey, Dad has a studio, is in biz, why doesn't he hire the kid?
Harumph!

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Post by chris harris » Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:59 pm

Brian wrote:Chris swung in on a rope, tried to rescue him, I cut the rope and Zep threw down the gauntlet, made a dash for the line, won the race and we all went home.
That's an interesting, albeit delusional, interpretation of what just happened.

So, you're saying that I chimed in to suggest that these people giving him hell for trying to find his son a job are over-reacting by trying to psychoanalyze his relationship with his son, and taking it to the seemingly ridiculous extreme of going waaaay off topic to discuss a photo on his (not his son's) myspace page, and then you put me in my place where?

Then, Zep suggested that no employer would even look at him without a degree, a stellar GPA and a demonstrated involvement in extra-curricular activities, which is complete and utter bullshit. And, this is the post that "won the race"?!?!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Never a dull moment in this place!

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Post by chris harris » Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:13 pm

And, can we please drop the ridiculous, and NOWHERE NEAR the topic discussion of Charles Manson? Your righteous indignation has no place in this thread.

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