Tape Machines that a friend is selling - Should I buy them?

[alexdingley]

I don't know much about buying used reel-to-reel decks, so I'm reaching out. A friend of a friend is selling two tape machines, and I'm curious to buy one of them, but honestly ??I've been tracking to a Tascam DSD stereo deck... would I be unlikely to enjoy tracking to a stereo analog machine?

One is an Otari MX5050 mk3 - 2-Track. he's also got a different unit that's a 4-track, but it's in really sore shape. I took a couple pics of the head-stack so that I could get some opinions.

He's also got an MCI JH110, and it looks to be in really clean shape. Stupid-me, didn't snap pics of the heads.

He says that both machines are in tip-top shape... They were well-maintained and were used in his small broadcast studio. They recorded dialog for a radio show, over the course of 20yrs.

He's looking to get $350 for the Otari MX5050, and he is willing to entertain a "non-ridiculous" offer on the MCI.

a) should I consider buying the Otari as a "transfer deck" / "maybe it'll be cool to track to machine" ???

b) does anyone wanna reach out to the guy to look at the MCI?

I guess, PM me if you want the guy's contact info....



THE MCI:




THE OTARI:

I can't tell if this is just horrible oxide build-up, or if it's hugely problematic head-wear

[kslight]

I'll be honest, I'd never want to sell a friend anything like that, I'd hate to become the guy to support them when it breaks, etc.. I know that's not what you're asking though, its just like I wouldn't want to sell a friend my car after driving it for 20 years?even if it ran perfectly for me, it is essentially the law that it will break down within a couple weeks and I will feel bad and/or obligated to help out, or he'd feel bitter about it?


Erm?anyway.


Being used for 20 years in a commercial environment screams to me, ready for a lot of maintenance?regardless of how well cared for it was. Despite being in "tip top shape" its obvious someone didn't bother to clean any tape fudge off of it when they were done?really it looks like they either did a pass with a bad reel, or he didn't clean it for several.

I bet a lot of that would clean off though, since you're asking. Really I would want to see what was behind the gunk?see if there's any kind gaps forming?

Does he have any of the service manuals, maintenance history, degaussers, etc??


If you're really interested, and he's a real friend, I'd have him clean it up and let you try it out for a bit and see if its what you're after before committing to the cash?make sure the thing works like you'd expect. I would assume that if you track to a DSD deck that you're after some degree of fidelity?this will certainly not reproduce what you're used to?whether that's a good thing or not is up to you.


I would probably pass unless it was an absolute steal and worked great (no sense in buying a boat anchor, even if its cheap)?not sure I'd really use a deck like that.

[Gregg Juke]

Send these pix to Chris at Mara Machines. Throw him a consultation fee (he sells refurbed/restored MCI's), but he will know what's up better than the average bear.

http://www.maramachines.com/Home.html

GJ

[alexdingley]

Yeah... good input, thanks guys!

KSlight ??I kinda figured that the fidelity wasn't gonna blow me away. I'm not multi-tracking to analog, so there's little "purist-brag" ability in having an analog mix deck, especially if it's not a supremely high-performing deck.

Greg ??Yeah, Chris came to mind; obviously. If you search for MCI JH.... anything ???photos of his modded machines are the first google results.

I'm just gonna pass on both, and hope that someone puts an ATR-102 up for sale, somewhere in my orbit.

If anyone else is interested ?? these machines are in the Philly burbs, and the guy was really nice / very reasonable. He wanted $350 for the Otari, but sounded like he'd entertain reasonable offers. The MCI ??he's been told it might be worth upwards of $1500, but is moving soon and it's huge... so he's motivated to get rid of it.

[j.harv]

I never understand why people who are trying to sell gear like this don't take a little time to clean things up. I mean, look at the gunk on those heads!!!

[kslight]

I never understand why people who are trying to sell gear like this don't take a little time to clean things up. I mean, look at the gunk on those heads!!!

I don't know, maybe they can't spare a few Q tips???

Oddly, I've seen this a lot on tape machines I've looked at?I've passed on a few because they were so nasty?and maybe they were fine but if that's all the care they put into possibly the easiest part of ownership, it makes you wonder how much they bothered with the insides?

But then, one of my 388s I got was pretty nasty?and I was sure that it wouldn't fire up when I got home?but its perfect, probably better running than my others. Why someone would let it get that way though..

[Sean Sullivan]

Looks like that's a MCI JH-110C, which is really the one you want...if you can get it at a decent price it's a great sounding, professional deck

[tapesandtubes]

My honest opinion, I'd keep looking...

[alexdingley]

Yeah... the MCI seemed to be in much more minty shape... if I had room for it, I would have taken it. But sadly, I don't think it would even fit through the stairway / doors of my house... so it's not destined for my world.

[eliya]

FWIW, JRF is really cool about talking to people about tape machines and heads and what not. I bought a Studer a little over a year ago, and prior to buying he said to send him a picture of the heads. He said that he obviously can't 100% guarantee the condition of the heads without looking at them through a microscope, but he said that they looked like they had a lot of life left. When I bought the machine I sent the headstack to him to get the heads relapped, cleaned, and adjusted. They have 60% life left.

The point of this is to always snap pictures of the heads and talk to JRF about it.

[Dingo]

The only way to know what's going on with the heads is to have JRF Magnetics look at them. Split the cost with your friend if you end up buying the machine, he pays if you don't. Otherwise, don't bother. Heads are expensive. Budget $1500 or so for a thorough check out and repair of the machine. If you're looking for the tape-y thing the JH110 is the better bet. It's expensive, but worth it sonically.

[honkyjonk]

A machine that has been in consistent use for 20 years is generally quite preferable to one that has been sitting in storage for 20 years.

The heads are the determining factor though. You can find heads for Otari 2 tracks. Might take some waiting, but they pop up.

Not sure about MCI though. Is it Chris Mara that has a yearly fee for tech support for MCI machines via skype or phone or whatever? I've always envied that nice little option that MCI owners can take advantage of.

BTW, it's not a horrible price for a working MX5050. I'd try to talk him down a little if it cleans up and the heads are good. But anyway, even if it's a junker, you can probably make most of that back from selling parts because the hi fi people are interested in these these days damn it. Look out for the capstan motor and the Omron relays.

[tmoneygetpaid]

Can't tell much from the MCI pics.

The Otari heads and everything else in the tape path looks dirty, but that doesn't mean much. It's not oxide buildup, it looks like tape buildup. The Quantegy/ Ampex tape stocks "shed" after a certain age and that's what it looks like is gunking up your heads. You can clean it off. Overall, that machine is really dirty, so you should thoroughly clean it, including some slight disassembly to get in the tough spots.

Without shelling out for a relapping or head report, you can determine some info from eyeballing heads, there are articles on the JRF site about what to look for.

Any tape machine is going to be a commitment to refurbishment, plus you'll have to get the tools if you don;t have them, and regular maintenance. Count on shelling out at least another $500 for a relapping from JRF, a new MRL, a Han-D-Mag, probably a new pinch roller (get the Athan one, it's an upgrade), cleaning supplies, a few piddly parts. To do this right you'll need equipment that you can align your machine regulalrly with-- an oscilloscope, and a good test kit with a signal gen and accurate volt or dB meter so you can regularly align the thing.

So ask yourself if you want to commit to this as a workflow, if it's a marketable thing to your clients, and if you have the time and money for getting the machine fixed and getting yourself setup.

The good thing about Otaris is they were ubiquitous in their day, so you can still find some shops that have parts machines, and you'll see parts on ebay regularly.