next step up for outboard gear to add "ambience"?

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brownplus
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next step up for outboard gear to add "ambience"?

Post by brownplus » Tue Feb 19, 2008 7:56 pm

having an awful room to record in has me leaning towards something (non-sofware) to add depth and space to my recordings.
only have some of the basics but wondering if ad/da converter or equalizer is what i should think about? or better micpre?

my puny/typical gear: eh tube micpre(like it), presonus micpre, akg omni-oktava mk219cond. mod-old ribbon-heil pr20 mics, tascam digi. portastudio-cooleditproII software-nice headphones(monitors not an option)-bbe comp. pedal,various chorus pedals, limiter pedal, fake dano tape looper pedal, fender tube champ and roland microcube, yamaha keyboard(my drums!...yuk!)

thanks for any avenues i can look into.
i can't look back at all the stuff i sold...its like looking back at worldcom stock sold the day after

small amps. big strings and single coils

RefD
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Post by RefD » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:06 pm

"ambience"?

*not quite sure what you're getting at but willing to add $0.02 in the most helpful way that can be managed*
?What need is there to weep over parts of life? The whole of it calls for tears.? -- Seneca

brownplus
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maybe not ambience but

Post by brownplus » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:14 pm

mixes are too seperated (i like the bleed through effect only can get with live) and too dull.
playing everything myself one by one makes everything stand out too much...id like something to set everything together a bit smoother, as you can tell its hard to get my point across.

Ill put it this way, i like what a sonic maximizer does for the first listen, but hate it after that....I basically want more control and less sheen but better control over my individual sounds

thats why i was thinking eq....but dont really know if everything would sound better(less dirty) if i had ad/da unit somewhere (other than in tascam)

or?
i can't look back at all the stuff i sold...its like looking back at worldcom stock sold the day after

small amps. big strings and single coils

RefD
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Post by RefD » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:47 pm

bleed...tried reamping?
?What need is there to weep over parts of life? The whole of it calls for tears.? -- Seneca

Tragabigzanda
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Post by Tragabigzanda » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:15 am

You ever run your tracks through your pedals? If not, I'd suggest experimenting with that a bit, and maybe add a spring reverb to your rig.

What's the drum situation? Are you in a place where you can't set up real drums? Drums are probably the most dynamic instrument you could ask for, and if you can't do it where you're at, then you should track drums at a buddy's house or something.

What about opening the door and putting a condenser in the next room, or in the trash barrel or something?

If you can track down the old Tape Op interview with Tchad Blake, you should read it. Real inspiring, how he gets different textures and space in his recordings.
Alex C. McKenzie

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Boogdish
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Post by Boogdish » Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:49 am

if you're in digital land and have the infinite tracks required to do this, you could try setting up a room mic somewhere in the room and record a room track for every track, and if you're DIing things, run them through an amp to get a room sound for that too.

kayagum
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Post by kayagum » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:58 am

Get or make a better room. Seriously.
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thecheat
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Post by thecheat » Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:18 am

+1 on kayagum, if not a whole room build yourself some baffles on wheels to surround drumsets and/or vocalists and soak up some of that horribleness.

Ive built quite a few of these myself and they work very well for my purposes, like you, i record in a horrible room, its a giant concrete warehouse, i have baffles in my corner where i mix and im building a few extra wheeled ones to have around. the hard part was making them without 703, but once you realize you can support kraft faced r-13 with something, you smack yourself in the forehead for being an idiot and build them easier and faster.

anyway

Ill post some plans for them if anyone is interested, they don't actually require rockwool or 703 (which for some insane reason is really hard to get in FL) and end up being much cheaper than some of the other designs i've seen. anywhoo, spending a couple hundred bucks on moveable sound treatments might help you more than a quirky box that only ends up on a few records.

just a thought. And if were not careful, this might end up in the Making a Space forum, and we all know what happens there!

Chris
"It's like Tom Jones Gargling a Hammer."
http://www.alpacaranchrecording.com

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kittonian
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Post by kittonian » Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:07 am

I would suggest doing something regarding room treatment for both the recording and the mixing space. If you can't hear what's actually going on, no matter what gear you purchase you'll still be having the same problems. Check out RealTraps. They make some really great products and the nice thing is you can hang them on the wall like a picture frame. That way, if you ever need to remove them it's not an issue.

For what it's worth, I'd get bass traps for all the corners, some to cover portions of the walls and ceiling and maybe a diffuser or two to spread things out naturally. It's not a small expense but it's one you'll be so glad you made in the long run.

Best of luck!
Joshua Aaron
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thecheat
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Post by thecheat » Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:27 am

Since were all talking about treating your room would you mind posting the dimensions and a few more specifics, all materials ect.? TapeOpers cant resist a project!

Chris
"It's like Tom Jones Gargling a Hammer."
http://www.alpacaranchrecording.com

brownplus
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horble horble room

Post by brownplus » Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:57 am

well, i dont have room for drums
room is about 10' by 12'

you mean i cant use pillows and dirty laundry in the corners for bass traps

I agree, lack of drums is prob. the most stifling thing...been thinking of those drumloops on cds but right now its fruityloops or yamaha keyboard...and i hate both...really miss my old drummer(s) buddys in seattle but as of this moment, dont know/have anyone to drum, and more importantly, im going for some odd rhythms (bush of ghosts, eno, etc..) and hoping to ...

run what i have through a "magicizer" to make it sound more lush..!!

though mic. placement is/has always been the #1 thing i feel also the only thing i can do besides treat the room...which is another problem as house will soon be up for sale and i have enough projects w/out buiulding something into walls etc...

Was thinking eq could lessen some bad sounds and improve others...but never really used one myself so....

thanks for info though
i can't look back at all the stuff i sold...its like looking back at worldcom stock sold the day after

small amps. big strings and single coils

streetfighterdub
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Post by streetfighterdub » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:10 am

here is an idea, maybe work out your parts at home then go to someone else's place to hang out and track? i've done that before where i've gone to a friends place who had a nice sounding high ceiling living room or something to record in. have you stuck things in the bathroom yet to get cool sounds?

if you are going to move soon, maybe just try and squeeze every idea and sound out of where you're at now, even the bad sounds. you mentioned you don't have the ability to record a drum set, what about other things that can sound like a drum. ever mic up a big card board box and get it to sound like a bass drum? what about metal sinks as "snare" sounds? i dunno. the one thing i suggest to a lot of people is that they get reason adapted if they don't have a drum program. you can actually load your own samples in ReDrum, even in the adapted version. i don't think i need to explain why that would be cool

brownplus
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thats cool...a porta drum!

Post by brownplus » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:31 am

yes!
actually saw some guys in NYC playing beatles with the drummer sporting some plastic buckets and boxes.....am thinking of that route now while setting up a date for a session guy i guess...
have been out of the bandscene so long and being in a new place makes it kinda hard to meet interested mates..

lastly...im frankly just pititful with software but reason might be up my alley...what about those yamaha mini-drum plastic pieces of poo...think i could use that to trigger?
had one loooong ago and couldnt really do rolls and stuff as the sensors didnt seem quick enough...
maybe stick with the plastic buckets and tongue drums im making...itll be mostly ethnic sounding drums anyway...?

GOOD IDEA :shock:
i can't look back at all the stuff i sold...its like looking back at worldcom stock sold the day after

small amps. big strings and single coils

BeepBeep
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Post by BeepBeep » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:48 am

Does anyone know what issue this interview was in?
Tragibigzanda wrote: If you can track down the old Tape Op interview with Tchad Blake, you should read it. Real inspiring, how he gets different textures and space in his recordings.

Tragabigzanda
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Post by Tragabigzanda » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:53 am

#16--great issue, also with Jim O'Rourke. You can still buy back issues of that one...
Alex C. McKenzie

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