Mic'ing a Bass with a Condensor

deadair · Post by **deadair** » Fri May 23, 2003 8:40 am

For some reason i never tried it until this past week..... sounded awesome! at3035 about 8-12" away from the cab. I tried blending the sound with a 421 right on the speaker, but no matter how much a moved it I couldnt get it to be in phase. I had assumed that with the distance that wouldnt be a problem, but i guess i was wrong. Either way i just went with the 3035 track and sounds great, so i'm not bummed, sure would have been handy to have one of those in-between-phase boxes though...... do others find it hard to get phase to work out when blending to mics on an instrument like this?

Sicily · Post by **Sicily** » Fri May 23, 2003 8:57 am

Of a DI and a condenser a few feet away from a guitar amp.

When I first stared recording I would just go direct by itself and that worked out alright, but it lacked a lot of the presence and the string noise that I wanted for cetain tracks.

I found that miking a guitar amp in conjunction with the DI gave me the desired presence and string noise I was looking for, but also rounded out the low end and generally made things a lot thicker. A pleasant surprise...

Browsing the various recording fourms out there, I have learned that a lot of folks record bass in similar ways.

trodden · Post by **trodden** » Fri May 23, 2003 9:18 am

last session, two bass band. One set up was a CAD E-100 (condensor) along with a 421. great!!!! and the other rig was miced with a RE-20 and a beyer soundstar (421 lookin mic). best bass i've gotten.

Russian Recording · Post by **Russian Recording** » Fri May 23, 2003 9:21 am

deadair wrote: I tried blending the sound with a 421 right on the speaker, but no matter how much a moved it I couldnt get it to be in phase. I had assumed that with the distance that wouldnt be a problem, but i guess i was wrong. ...... do others find it hard to get phase to work out when blending to mics on an instrument like this?

deadair...
If you put two mics on the same source, but at different distances from the source, you are most likely going to get phase issues, especially on a bass cab. The problem is that the "soundwave" coming from the speaker reaches the two microphones at a different time, so that the further mic is actually delayed from the close mic. This slight delay causes phase cancelations. Since bass wavelenghts are so large, a slight time delay casues very noticeable and extreme phase cancelation. When you put the two mics at the same distance from the speaker, you will find that your phase problems will be greatly reduced. If you are using computer based recording/editing software, and you are recording each mic to a seperate channel. you can time-align the two channels so that the crests and peaks of the waveform are aligned down to the sample. You can also fix your problem with a digital mixer by simply delaying the close microphone so that it is coherent with the further mic. If recording analog, and you have an accurate digital delay, you can simply run out of the mic-pre your close mic is plugged into, and run it into your delay box. Set the appropriate delay with your ears or by the distance/time formula and send your signal straight to tape.

I hope this helps,
mike

xonlocust · Post by **xonlocust** » Fri May 23, 2003 10:52 am

the current recording im working on, i used an audio technica 4033 on bass. that was the 3rd choice after using and not liking the d112, then senn 421. it gave a lot better definition that the dynamics. also, i've seen a shure sm81 used nicely - they apparantly have a ruler flat freq response down to like 50hz.

i remeber reading long ago that bob weston fancied the 4033 on bass guitar - and this current recording is the first time it worked for me.

brian beattie · Post by **brian beattie** » Fri May 23, 2003 12:00 pm

That AT 4033 is a peach on bass. My favorite. I've used it on little, tiny quiet amps, and big fat loud amps. It just has eggs.
I usually will try a ribbon 2nd, but I sure love 57's on loud bass amps, too.
brian

Russian Recording · Post by **Russian Recording** » Fri May 23, 2003 12:26 pm

Ill second the ribbon on the bass. I used an RCA BK-5 with huge success. I had to keep the volume pretty low, but it sounded great.

Beyer M88s sound good as well. I've seen the 4033 used by Mr. Albini as well as the 4031. Both sounded pretty great. The 4031 really pulled off the edgy overdriven bass thing while providing a ton of low end.
mike

wayne kerr · Post by **wayne kerr** » Fri May 23, 2003 12:35 pm

My two favorite bass rig mics -

47FET
Blue Mouse

Not necessarilly in that order, it just depends on which oen I like better with whatever rig I've got to work with.

Both deliver seriously big bottom without a lot of rumble and midrange detail til tuesday! I usually mult 'em and run one track through a RAT and a Distressor (set for "obliterate") and then blend the two signals til its just the right amount jangle with the fat fuzz... sorry to use those technical terms!

Speaking of EL, anyone here used a Phatso? I have yet to get my hands on one and would love some opinions.

PS - used a Mouse on Mike Watt's upright for an upcoming Li'l Pit release, and it's just fabuloso - I wish you all could hear it!

E

DeafinONEear · Post by **DeafinONEear** » Fri May 23, 2003 12:41 pm

you didn't put a ribbon on the poll....

is this upright or electric?

if upright, m160 sounds yuuuuuummmmy.

arrrrrrrgh.

Russian Recording · Post by **Russian Recording** » Fri May 23, 2003 12:46 pm

yes, ive used a mouse on an upright and it sounds phenomenal. Acrually i used it in conjunction with a Beyer M500. super nice. Do you have the transformerless Mouse or the Transformer Mouse? I used the one with the transormer (black) and supposedly there is a noticeable differance b/w the two.

mike

insta-fame · Post by **insta-fame** » Fri May 23, 2003 2:03 pm

i get varied results depending on what kind of speaker cab is being used. 4033's sound good for 15" speakers(6" from speaker), i like my akg solidtube for 12's or 10's a little back(12"-18") , for multiple 8", or ampeg 8X10" i sometimes like a d-112(18"-24"). depends on the weather too.....and the phase of the moon...

jspartz · Post by **jspartz** » Fri May 23, 2003 2:28 pm

I have been using an RE-20 with good results. I have not tried a condensor myself but I have heard that the AT 4047 works well for bass. Has anyone tried it?

jason

Allcalm · Post by **Allcalm** » Fri May 23, 2003 3:19 pm

I'm all about the RE-20, I had quite good results all around.. My favoite way is to plop a U-87 in front and mix with a DI.

psychicoctopus · Post by **psychicoctopus** » Sat May 24, 2003 4:31 am

bignerd wrote:You can also fix your problem ... by simply delaying the close microphone so that it is coherent with the further mic. If recording analog, and you have an accurate digital delay, you can simply run out of the mic-pre your close mic is plugged into, and run it into your delay box. Set the appropriate delay with your ears or by the distance/time formula and send your signal straight to tape.

Really? Can you name some delays that have enough fidelity to be effective at this? We're talking about sub-millisecond stuff, right?

joel hamilton · Post by **joel hamilton** » Sat May 24, 2003 6:52 am

bass: 4033 and an re20.

I love the 4033 on anything that needs to bark.

4033/bk5 has been my starting point for rock guitar for about 7 years now.

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Mic'ing a Bass with a Condensor

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