Sonar 8 or Logic 9 - PC or Mac ?

[flapmaggot]

Guys,

I know I'll have to make up my own mind based on my needs/research. But I'm thinking that any nugget of information you can impart will help me make a decision.

Background - I currently run a small garage studio where I do demos, CD's etc for local bands. Last year I had around 6 paying customers (that's all I can psychologically handle). The studio is primarilly for my band the drool brothers.

Change - As of late, I've been getting better clients and more requests from bands that want to record live. My style of production used to be, bass and drums first (GROOVE - remember that) and layer everything above that. Therefore, I would record 8 or 10 tracks up front and be fine. Now I need more tracks coming in.

Problem - I run a P4/2k gig ram/with adobe audition 1.5/RME Multigace/Tango 24 for 8 additional ins light pipe. My computer is just too old trying to handle 16 incoming tracks doing multiple takes of each song. Not enough juevos and it's starting to slow, crash and act funny --- though I am getting by.

Needs: I want the easiest file mangement sytem - I hate audition for this because it asks you a million questions when closing sessions. The easist punch in/comp ability. I want a stable system and no longer want to build a PC myself. The problem with getting a MAC is that the tower will cost $2500, logic $500 and the PCIe Card for my RME $500 = $3500 Whereas I can have a turnkey sytem with duo core PC with Sonar delivered to my doorstep for $1400

By going PC again am I shooting myself in the foot? Will I be able to do 16 18 tracks coming in without worry. Is MAC the ultimate solution? I worked a live recording with a Mac Pro PT HD without a hick up doing 18 tracks at once - 5 to 10 takes each - can't afford PT HD though! Once again, file management is essential. Wisdom needed!!

[ThePitz]

I think the mac/logic combo is extremely hard to beat. I've never plugged a piece of equipment into my computer (Macbook Pro) that wasn't instantly recognized by both the computer AND Logic. I've never been able to throw more tracks at this system than it could handle. (never recorded more than 16 at a time through.)

Anyways - it seems like every time there's a new Windows OS - there's nothing but headaches and nightmares. Never had a problem with an OSX or Logic update.

That said - I have no experience recording on a Windows machine... All I can tell you is I have never had a problem recording on a Mac.

[Sculli]

Loving my Mac and Logic 9 at this time.

[Gentleman Jim]

I'm using Logic 8 on a G5 tower and also a MacBook Pro. I'm really happy with the choice I made. I've done 32 tracks into the MBP with no problem, but I wasn't overdubbing, so the buffer was set to maximum.

Honestly, either choice should be able to get you 16+ tracks in without a problem. If you're disciplined enough to be one of those PC users who keeps crap off their machine then I wouldn't worry too much. But if you spend half your time downloading every stupid trial demo of software that you read about in Future Music or whatever, then you should avoid PC at all costs.

As far as file management, I prefer the Mac way of doing things. Others will feel differently. I don't know who you'll agree with.

[flapmaggot]

Thanks for the comments. It's just the price difference that freaks me out. Ultimately, I know I should get a MAC and logic and move on but I'm just a tight wad. I may have to sell the TASCAM 38 Maybe record a few cover bands

Overall I can make the money back in a short time.

Digression: What is the logic 9 learning curve like?

[route-electrique]

I've experiences from both worlds, and even i have great system atm i've had problems on the Mac side aswell. However, i would never go back to PC world. Mac system changed my life totally (in a good way hehe). In the PC world my DAW was always offline from internet and it was dedicated to music, nothing else. I think it makes huge difference in performance (in the PC world).

My problems on the Mac are pretty annoying and only solvable via hardware changes. Main problem is when i start my Mac, my 30" HP screen dosen't wake up, it always on suspend mode. Sometimes it wakes up on the 3rd try orso, sometimes it ruins my motivation, ideas and i give up (talk about inspiration killer). If i connect PC Laptop to that screen, sreen wakes up straight away. ATI says display adapters "drivers" are included on the OSX install. Great. Weird thing is i didn't recognize this problem at all 6-8 months ago, so i thought my system is fine. So i can't return my HP screen anymore. My choices are to buy another 30" screen or buy different display adapter; there's two choices atm i think, one is 200? and other is 500? (this one has seperate OSX drivers).

500? investment is quite much for having working screen!. So, this is just one example of Mac problem. Really annoying one. If i was PC user, there weren't any problems with screen/display adapter.

[Jay Reynolds]

+1 for OSX+Logic.

For 16-18 tracks, I'm not sure you need a Mac Pro. I just did an entire day of 18 tracks through a MacBook Pro with Logic Express.

[ctmsound]

http://www.gainsaver.com/

Look under Apple Mac Pro. Good used prices.

[flapmaggot]

Wow - if gainsaver is truly reliable - that option looks pretty good. I wonder if any tape ops can give feedback on gainsaver.

Thanks!

[ctmsound]

I had a customer come in my shop the other day that turned me on to the site. He brought in a mac pro he bought off there for me to put software on. Machine was pristine and worked perfect.

[tdbajus]

I have used Logic for about 5 years now, and it is a matter of priorities.

Logic comes with a boatload of great sounding plugins, soft synths, etc etc. I am particularly impressed with the new logic's guitar amp simulator, which does not make me want to vomit in my mouth.

That is high praise from me.

Also, as far as I can tell, the midi implementation is very flexible. Not much of a midi guy, myself.

However, as I have posted several times, Logic is the worst audio editor I have ever used. Period. I have been working with DAW stuff for about 15 years now, and was once employed editing music beds. Every single package I have every used, Mac or PC, has been a better editor.

Want to tighten up that snare hit? Good luck trying to get it to snap to the grid. It will snap before the grid line, it will snap after the gridline. In fact it will snap just about anywhere but where it is obviously supposed to be. It's not always obvious, either, until you have to go all the way back to the beginning.

Editing drum mistakes, creative editing, having fun with making loops- all very unlikely in Logic. How hard is it to make a loop? Set an In Point, set an Out Point, and loop without popping. Easy, right?

Have never, ever gotten it to work in Logic. Got it to work in Garageband, without looking at a manual. Before that, got it to work in Live, without a manual. Before THAT, got it to work in ACID, in the 90s, having never seen anything like it before. Got it to work. No manual.

With a manual and 3 other people, can't get Apple Loops to work. POS.

RE: mac vs PC- I have been pretty happy working with Ableton Live, which has a beautiful interface, OK plug-ins (though I have a UAD-1 and a MIO2882, so I have all the plugs I need). However, I used to use Vegas, and thought it was a fast, flexible, wonderful editor. ACID was great too.

I prefer OSX, cuz momma brought me up a UNIX boy, but I have found most audio stuff on a mac to be kind of frustratingly clumsy. I get sick of trying to trick the mac into doing what I want it to do.

[germaniac]

Hi 'Maggot!

First best option: write your own software and OS.

Second best option: cassette tape!


Love,
G'maniac

[flapmaggot]

better yet, two ghetto blasters - ping pong takes back and forth!

Sold!

Thanks Germ - the Maggot

[raweber]

If you're going to go the Mac route, don't forget Digital Performer. My first CD was mixed on DP (before I knew anything about DAWs - I assumed it was Pro Tools!) and I was so impressed I couldn't believe it.

Worth checking out.

For the record, at home I use a PC with Sonar 7, but's that's because I already had a PC and serious budget issues.

[flapmaggot]

Raweber,

How is the stability factor wiith your PC and Sonar?