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Another Plate Reverb
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crashsick
buyin' gear


Joined: 08 Mar 2004
Posts: 512

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 6:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

i've never used it but this looks like that way to go, read the simple manual for instructions.

http://www.voxengo.com/product/deconvolver/


here are some test tones too

http://www.dogstar.dantimax.dk/testwavs/


steven
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mrmiller
audio school graduate


Joined: 14 Jan 2007
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 7:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Yeah, I was going to do that when I remembered a problem I was encountering. I think one of the screws is vibrating against the plate (the one that attaches the driver), and I botched up unscrewing it. In short, does anyone have any bright ideas for removing a screw that's in a smooth, threaded cylinder? Oy.
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crashsick
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 8:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

not sure what you mean, are you talking about the ghost?
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mrmiller
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Joined: 14 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Yeah. I was noticing that at high amplitudes, the signal seemed to peak, except it was audible acoustically through the plate. I'm thinking I shouldn't have had a washer directly against the plate and should use rubber washers. Well, I have the rubber washers, but in the process of trying to remove the Ghost, the threaded metal part came off of the plastic, so it's now stuck on the screw and I can't get it off for the life of me. I can reattach it to the ghost with some super glue I'm sure, or come up with a different way to mount the thing by filing down the plastic protrusion so I have more surface area in contact. I got rid of the clear plastic piece so I could use the center screw. But yeah, now the screw is stuck in the metal threaded part and I tried everything to keep a grip on the metal part and turn the screw with no success. Will try more, and then I'll hopefully be able to get some IRs cleanly. I'm just hoping its not the driver itself peaking. I don't think it is, because I can turn up the amp a lot and it still only peaks in the same place. I think it's the frequency causing something to resonate and vibrate against the plate.
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crashsick
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Joined: 08 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 10:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

that sucks, not sure what else you could try, but getting the screw out of the threaded part is nearly vital. as for the peaking, just guesses but if its not the ghost then start making sure everything else is tight as opposed to flipping around. and then start to tighten up your tension springs or turn buckles or whatever you have, and see if the peaking changes with the resonance. maybe move around the pickups too.

or if you just want to give up, grab some 5 minute epoxy and just glue the ghost to the plate.

good luck,

steven
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fazeka
steve albini likes it


Joined: 07 May 2003
Posts: 337

PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Hello,

I've been doing some research as of recent as I am hoping to give a shot at building me a plate. I think I am both quite willing and able to do the job, but I did have a few questions regarding it, mainly in regards to the supplies.

The few steel shops here in town have 26 gauge (0.018) in either galvanized or stainless 4 x 10 sheets.

1) Galvanized sounds tempting with it's rust-resistance quality, but I am fearing the zinc plating may have an effect on the sound. Thoughts?

2) None of those I called said they would be able to cut down to 3 x 6. One said he wouldn't/couldn't as he was really only a distributor and the other one said they don't have a means of cutting something that thin. I imagine it would not be hard to cut myself, but then again, I am fearing there is a huge difference between having it cut gracefully/cleanly with the proper shear/industrial cutter and me cutting it with an electric jigsaw... Thoughts?

Finally, I'm sure all know about the site that supplied parts/kits that is no longer available, www.errico-associates.com. So where are you all getting your parts from? I know there are other manufacturers of the drivers and the pickups, but I was really wanting a source for the yoke that was offered in the kit:



Thoughts?
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mrmiller
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Joined: 14 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Weeell, I ended up going the route of stainless steel. I kept it at the full 4x10 sheet size, figuring it couldn't hurt. I was really hoping to find full hard steel, but ended up only being able to find tempered, so it's a little more malleable. I also couldn't find 28ga and went with 26ga. I don't know about you, but I called literally every steel place in the New England phone books and found ONE place that had 26ga in anything but galvanized. The parts I was able to attain from my local hardware shop, just a little TrueValue branch. If there's nothing like that, I'd check out McMaster-Carr (http://www.mcmaster.com) because they have a lot of small parts.

What's more important than any of the materials is having someone to do all the heavy work for you. You need someone to do all that welding and cutting. It was the most expensive part of the whole thing for me, and I had access to MIT's own machine shop, and paid a lot less than the hourly rate because I kept them to their quote and they went way over without telling me.

As far as the yokes, what I'm working with is similar, though not two-sided like that. It's just a piece of steel with threads on one end, and a hole on the other, so I put a screw with a nut through the hole and the plate end, and tighten a nut on the frame end to control tension. This setup was strong enough that I overtensioned the frame so that the long steel tubing was actually bending at a fairly alarming angle--I got nervous and loosened it after that, but needless to say, good construction and the right materials hold up under a lot.

As for cutting... I would steer clear. I had a hell of a time just drilling a hole in that stuff for my driver, so I can't imagine cutting would go very well. More over, I assume like me you're going to have soft tempered metal, which means that it will deform easily. Despite being thin, the stuff is mighty tough. If we're comparing to EMT's specs as well, 3x6 is an under approximation of their size, as they were working in meters, neh? I did all this research a while ago, but 4x10 isn't that far off either from what I remember as 1x2 meters. Moreover, I may be wrong about this, but if you're cutting the steel, I think they may have special sheers for cutting sheet metal as opposed to using a saw. Seems like a very messy implement.

Hope that helps... anything else? Razz

As far as some stuff on my end... I feel like I'm missing some practical knowledge about how I should be driving the thing. I'm getting that buildup shaking even after fixing the mounting, so I don't know where it's coming from. I don't have the unit in any sort of case, and I've been having trouble getting a good signal level out of it. As a result, I'm boosting the signal into the plate, which exacerbates the shaking noise. At what point am I overdriving the plate? If I can hear the reverb in the room, with the plate acting as a speaker? I've got my preamp gaining all the way and turning up the output on the preamp, but it's still not a great signal, and the noise on the plate starts creeping in--it picks up a little bit of radio. I'm not sure the best next step to take. Should I build a case? Is the shaking something I can actually fix or is it a result of over-driving the plate? I need some way to distance the noise from the signal so I can actually use it.
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fazeka
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

OK. Well, after calling several shops (one of which was extremely rude, I might add), I settled on some 28 ga stainless. It comes in 3x10 sheets. The place I got it from had 3 left and all were slightly damaged. I picked the one that had the least damage. The "damage" consists of a line of slightly raised "bumps" every few inches down the center of the sheet. Looks to be from nails driven into the bottom of the crate used to hold the sheets. Evil or Very Mad These sheets were obviously on the bottom of the crate, just my luck. It was either this 28 gauge cheap or 26 gauge for double the price. I figured that these bumps were so slight that at $48 I would take a chance. What do you think? Could 24 slight bumps/pimples significantly affect the sound? Also, 28 gauge is obviously thinner than 26, so I am hoping it will be closer in that regard to an actual EMT plate... Laughing

The cool thing is that they will cut the 3x10 down to 3x6 for me! Mr. Green

Next, I need to pick up some pickups and a driver... What do y'all suggest?
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crashsick
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

not sure if you've seen this but this is my lo-fi take on it

http://thesquarewaveparade.com/plate.html

the ghost is really nice and i don't think you can go wrong with it.



steven
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mrdibs
gettin' sounds


Joined: 10 May 2007
Posts: 101
Location: New York

PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 10:25 am    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

For a quick tutorial on how to make easy and acceptable impulse responses, see here:

http://www.noisetime.com/impulsecreation.html

Just download the diracs and run them through the gear and record the results! Nice and easy.
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idylldon
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Joined: 26 Mar 2004
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Location: Idyllwild, CA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 1:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

fazeka wrote:
but I was really wanting a source for the yoke that was offered in the kit:



Thoughts?


Yeah, these are made using totally off-the-shelf items at any hardware store. The yoke is deigned to be used with a clevis pin and the yokes are threaded as you can see by the bolt at the bottom of the pic. Nothing difficult assembling one of these at all.

Cheers,
--
Don
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fazeka
steve albini likes it


Joined: 07 May 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 4:12 am    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

OK, here we go. 28 gauge stainless 3 x 6 and 3 x 4 sheets, from one 3 x 10 sheet:



Total cost including cutting: $75. Not bad!

I can do a cathedral and a hall! Mr. Green

Got the Vidsonix on eBay...

What about pickups? Do I just use Barcus Berry or Fishman acoustic guitar pickups? Confused

What's a recommended noise-free amp to drive the driver?
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fazeka
steve albini likes it


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:37 am    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Finally got in touch with one James Cunningham, who was the guy responsible for the Ecoplate. He has some custom drivers and pickups available. Mr. Green
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j_howell
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Joined: 08 Feb 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Contact info for the Ecoplate guy?
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fazeka
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2008 11:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Another Plate Reverb Reply with quote

Over a year later, I'm only getting around to this thing now...

I recently had a frame welded up and now have the sheet stretched out on the frame. Sorry for the poor-quality pic:



Next up, I need to afix a damping plate and then get the driver and pickups mounted.

Will update this thread accordingly.
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